Envy of God and the Path of Devotion

А. Ч. Бхактиведанта Свами Прабхупада · Бомбей · 1974

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BG 9.1श्रीभगवानुवाचइदं तु ते गुह्यतमं प्रवक्ष्याम्यनसूयवे ।ज्ञानं विज्ञानसहितं यज्ज्ञात्वा मोक्ष्यसेऽशुभात् ॥१॥śrī-bhagavān uvācaidaṁ tu te guhyatamaṁpravakṣyāmy anasūyavejñānaṁ vijñāna-sahitaṁyaj jñātvā mokṣyase 'śubhātThe Supreme Personality of Godhead said: My dear Arjuna, because you are never envious of Me, I shall impart to you this most conﬁdential knowledge and realization, knowing which you shall be relieved of the miseries of material existence.

Qualifications and characteristics of bhakti

Prabhupāda: Yes, the first qualification is anasūyave.

Dr. Patel: Anasūyave, one who is not [indistinct] against God.

Prabhupāda: No. One who is not envious. A person generally... All conditioned souls, they are envious of God. Envious. "Why He should be God? I am God. I am God." So Arjuna is not like that type of. Therefore he is speaking to Arjuna.

He is devotee. In the Fourth Chapter also, He said, bhakto 'si priyo 'si Therefore Kṛṣṇa does not expose Himself unless one is devotee. This is first qualification. So to understand Bhagavad-gītā one must be a devotee.

The so-called jñānī, yogī, they cannot understand. It is not possible, because they are trying to become God. Although it is simply dream, they can never become, but they are envious, that "Why Kṛṣṇa should be God?

I have got so many gods." Anasūyave.

Dr. Patel: Rāja-vidya rāja-guhyaṁ pavitram idam uttamam pratyakṣa...

Prabhupāda: Avagamam.

Dr. Patel: ...avagamaṁ dharmyaṁ su-sukhaṁ kartum avyayam

Prabhupāda: Yes. And the bhakti-yoga... This is bhakti-yoga. Therefore it is rāja-vidya; when all kinds of learning, it is the king of.

Chandobhai: King of all.

Dr. Patel: King of. Is coming up.

Prabhupāda: So rāja-vidya and rāja-guhyam: most confident, very secret. It is not... And pavitram, uttamam.

Dr. Patel: Pratyakṣa avagamam.

Prabhupāda: And pratyakṣa avagamaṁ dharmyam. If you are jñānī, karmī, yogī, you cannot immediately directly perceive whether actually you have got the thing. But bhakti-yoga is like that.

Dr. Patel: Su-sukhaṁ. Kartum avyayam.

Prabhupāda: Bhakti-yoga, if you perform, you will perceive that "Yes, I am in this stage. I am in this stage." That has been described by Rūpa Gosvāmī.

Just like when you are hungry and you are eating something, you can understand... [aside:] Don't come very near. You can understand that how much satisfaction you have got by eating.

You haven't got to ask anybody, "Whether I am eating?" You can understand. The bhakti-yoga is so nice thing that if you execute it, you will understand your position.

And it is su-sukham. To execute bhakti-yoga, there is no difficulty. It is always happy. Just like our program.

Program is chant, dance, take prasādam. And if you take yoga system, jñāna system, first of all you have to become a very great, learned scholar, and then yoga system, you have to practice so many āsanas, press your nose, and so many things.

But here everything is very happy = chant, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, dance and then take prasādam, and you understand where you are.

This is the su-sukham. And avyayam. Avyayam means whatever little bhakti-yoga you have advanced, that is permanent. BG 9.3अश्रद्दधानाः पुरुषा धर्मस्यास्य परन्तप ।अप्राप्य मां निवर्तन्ते मृत्युसंसारवर्त्मनि ॥३॥aśraddadhānāḥ puruṣādharmasyāsya parantapaaprāpya māṁ nivartantemṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmaniThose who are not faithful in this devotional service cannot attain Me, O conqueror of enemies. Therefore they return to the path of birth and death in this material world.Ah.

"And those who have no faith in bhakti-yoga, they do not get Me. They simply labor." That's all. Śrama eva hi kevalam They are wasting time. That's all.

As soon as we say, the time wasters, they become angry, "Oh, why you are saying? Don't criticize others." But if we say...

Satya bole ta mare latha [laughter] suta jagalda.[?] If you bluff, "Oh, you are doing very nice, you are doing very nice," oh, he will be very pleased.

And if I say that "You rascal, you are doing all, simply wasting your time," he will not be... Mūrkhāyopadeṣo hi prakopāya.

The inconceivable potency of God

BG 9.4मया ततमिदं सर्वं जगदव्यक्तमूर्तिना ।मत्स्थानि सर्वभूतानि न चाहं तेष्ववस्थितः ॥४॥mayā tatam idaṁ sarvaṁjagad avyakta-mūrtināmat-sthāni sarva-bhūtānina cāhaṁ teṣv avasthitaḥBy Me, in My unmanifested form, this entire universe is pervaded. All beings are in Me, but I am not in them.

Yes, yes. BG 9.5न च मत्स्थानि भूतानि पश्य मे योगमैश्वरम् ।भूतभृन्न च भूतस्थो ममात्मा भूतभावनः ॥५॥na ca mat-sthāni bhūtānipaśya me yogam aiśvarambhūta-bhṛn na ca bhūta-sthomamātmā bhūta-bhāvanaḥAnd yet everything that is created does not rest in Me. Behold My mystic opulence! Although I am the maintainer of all living entities and although I am everywhere, I am not a part of this cosmic manifestation, for My Self is the very source of creation.Yes. So this is His inconceivable potency. Everything is resting on Him. Without Him, there is nothing.

Nothing can exist. Still, the same argument comes again, that because the dog or the anything is resting on me, it does not mean I am dog. Daridra, he is resting on me, that does not mean I am daridra. Yes.

This is the... This is wrong conception, misleading people. This kind of coined word, simply misleading people.

Dr. Patel: Na ca mat-sthāni bhūtāni. Even though He says...

Prabhupāda: Yes. I have nothing to do with daridra.

Dr. Patel: Therefore He said mat-sthāni bhūtāni.

Prabhupāda: He is suffering of his own karma.

Dr. Patel: But here a little difficulty for me. Here on the first line He says, mat-sthāni sarva-bhūtāni Second line He says, na ca mat-sthāni bhūtāni paśya me yogam aiśvaram.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Therefore, na ca mat-sthāni: "Although I am there, I am not there." That is inconceivable, simultaneously not also, just to warn these people that although Nārāyaṇa is within the daridra, in the dog, that does not mean "I am dog or I am daridra."

Dr. Patel: Bhūta-bhṛn na ca bhūta-stho mamātmā bhūta-bhāvanaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Bhūta-stha bhūta-bhāvanaḥ: "Everything is coming from Me. I am also within that, but still..." It is called acintya-bhedābheda, that "I am there; I am not there."

Dr. Patel: Yathākāśa-sthito nityaṁ vāyuḥ sarvatra-go mahān.

Prabhupāda: Ah, this is the example.

Dr. Patel: Tathā sarvāṇi bhūtāni mat-sthānīty upadhāraya

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like this cloud. The cloud, we say "In the sky." The cloud is not in the sky; it is on the air. They mistake this, that "Nārāyaṇa is there." Nārāyaṇa is not there. Nārāyaṇa is separate. That is their foolishness.

Divine control over material creation

BG 9.7सर्वभूतानि कौन्तेय प्रकृतिं यान्ति मामिकाम् ।कल्पक्षये पुनस्तानि कल्पादौ विसृजाम्यहम् ॥७॥sarva-bhūtāni kaunteyaprakṛtiṁ yānti māmikāmkalpa-kṣaye punas tānikalpādau visṛjāmy ahamO son of Kuntī, at the end of the millennium all material manifestations enter into My nature, and at the beginning of another millennium, by My potency, I create them again.

Yes. Because everything is coming from Him. Yato vā imāni bhūtāni jāyante. Again they are given a chance to prosecute the result of his karma. And there is chance also to become a devotee.

Therefore Kṛṣṇa, by His confidential servant, He preaches, "Take to this." But if they do not take, then again kalpa-kṣaye, again enters.

Dr. Patel: Kalpādau visṛjāmy aham.

Prabhupāda: And again there is kalpa. Again they come out. In this way they do not become liberated. Just like the child, those who are being, what is called, contraceptive method, abortion. These are very sinful.

Because they have done killing, so they enter into the mother's womb and they are again killed, and again enter into the mother's womb, and again killed. He does not see the light.

Similarly, those who are sinful, they are given chance in material manifestation, "Now work for Kṛṣṇa consciousness." But they do not do that. Again enters, again come out. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate This is going on.

How much they are wasting their time, not taking to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. BG 9.8प्रकृतिं स्वामवष्टभ्य विसृजामि पुनः पुनः ।भूतग्राममिमं कृत्स्नमवशं प्रकृतेर्वशात् ॥८॥prakṛtiṁ svām avaṣṭabhyavisṛjāmi punaḥ punaḥbhūta-grāmam imaṁ kṛtsnamavaśaṁ prakṛter vaśātThe whole cosmic order is under Me. Under My will it is automatically manifested again and again, and under My will it is annihilated at the end.Now visṛjāmi. The God, He creates. Here they comes.

The rascals, they do not believe it, that "There is no creator." The Jains, they do not believe it, that creator has done it.

"It has come automatically." Buddhist philosophy is like that, that "Everything is coming by combination..."

Dr. Patel: Prakṛti and puruṣa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is wrong theory. Actually, He says visṛjāmi, ahaṁ visṛjāmi: "I do."

Dr. Patel: Prakṛtiṁ svām avaṣṭabhya: "Controlling my prakṛti."

Prabhupāda: Avaṣṭabhya, now entering.

Dr. Patel: "Entering into My prakṛti, I am sṛjāmi, punaḥ punaḥ."

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. He is outside; He is inside.

Indian: And then leave it in the control of the prakṛti, prakṛter vaśāt, avaṣaṁ prakṛter vaṣāt. Bhūta-grāmam imaṁ kṛtsnam avaṣām prakṛter vaśāt.

Prabhupāda: Bhūta-grāmam, not He.

Dr. Patel: Bhūta-grāmam, is due to the prakṛti, after creating the bhūtas.

Prabhupāda: Yes. BG 9.9न च मां तानि कर्माणि निबध्नन्ति धनंजय ।उदासीनवदासीनमसक्तं तेषु कर्मसु ॥९॥na ca māṁ tāni karmāṇinibadhnanti dhanañjayaudāsīna-vad āsīnamasaktaṁ teṣu karmasuO Dhanañjaya, all this work cannot bind Me. I am ever detached from all these material activities, seated as though neutral.Yes. The same thing, that just like a judge orders, "This man should be hanged." But the judge is not affected by such thing.

He's not affected. Just like you surgical, you are going on surgical operation. You are not affected.

The man is crying, "Oh, here, doctor, you are killing me, killing me, killing me." But the killing or not killing, doctor sāhīb is not interested.

BG 9.10मयाध्यक्षेण प्रकृतिः सूयते सचराचरम् ।हेतुनानेन कौन्तेय जगद्विपरिवर्तते ॥१०॥mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥsūyate sa-carācaramhetunānena kaunteyajagad viparivartateThis material nature, which is one of My energies, is working under My direction, O son of Kuntī, producing all moving and nonmoving beings. Under its rule this manifestation is created and annihilated again and again.

Yes. This is the... These rascal atheist class, they think that prakṛti is creating, prakṛti is creating, that the ocean is created by prakṛti. But why the ocean does not come here, fifty, sixty years.

Because there is order that "You cannot come here." This big ocean, immediately, in one minute, it can swallow up whole Bombay. Therefore it is controlled. It is controlled by the Supreme. Mayādhyakṣeṇa.

The whole worldly affair is going on... The godless atheists, they cannot understand it, that behind this prakṛti, the wonderful prakṛti, so many things happening. It is not happening independently.

Dr. Patel: By the order of God.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Mayādhyakṣeṇa: "Under My control."

Atheistic frustration versus divine shelter

BG 9.11अवजानन्ति मां मूढा मानुषीं तनुमाश्रितम् ।परं भावमजानन्तो मम भूतमहेश्वरम् ॥११॥avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāmānuṣīṁ tanum āśritamparaṁ bhāvam ajānantomama bhūta-maheśvaramFools deride Me when I descend in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature as the Supreme Lord of all that be.

Now, these mūḍhas, they will think, "Huh? It is controlled by Kṛṣṇa? Huh. He is ordinary man like this." A mūḍha. Paraṁ bhāvam ajānanto. He does not know how much powerful is Kṛṣṇa, the mūḍha.

Dr. Patel: But you see, this is not like this, that those fools... [break]

Prabhupāda: That is also another mūḍha. But suppose if Kṛṣṇa says that "I am controlling the whole universe," the mūḍha will not believe it. "Huh? How is that? How...?

Such a big, gigantic prakṛti, and He is a person, He can control?" The mūḍha cannot understand. He cannot understand that how much powerful is Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: Paraṁ bhāvam ajānantaḥ maheśvaram.

Prabhupāda: Paraṁ bhāvam ajānantaḥ. They do not know what is the all-omniscient nature of Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: The spiritual power of His. No. Paraṁ bhāva? Moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo mogha-jñānā vicetasaḥ

Prabhupāda: Therefore, as soon as these rascal, they get little power, yogic perfection, they think, "I have become God. I have become God."

Dr. Patel: Mogha-jñānā vicetasaḥ. [laughing]

Prabhupāda: Yes. Rascal, he thinks that because "I can make like this, little gold, therefore I have become God."

Dr. Patel: Because they can go to moon...

Prabhupāda: The rascal does not think that "I am making, say, two grains or five grains of gold, but one who has made gold mines, millions, so He will be God or I will be God?" The rascal does not think that.

And other rascals follow, "Oh, here is God. Here is God. He is creating gold." You see? Therefore mūḍha.

Dr. Patel: Moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo mogha-jñānā vicetasaḥ

Prabhupāda: Ah, moghāśā. They are thinking that "I will become like this, I will become like this." Karmīs are thinking like this, jñānīs are thinking like this, yogīs are...

But they are all false, mūḍhas. Moghāśā. Their hope will be frustrated. Moghāśā. Moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo Mogha means frustration. Moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo

Dr. Patel: Rākṣasīm āsurīṁ caiva prakṛtiṁ mohinīṁ aśritāḥ.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Mohinīm. They are that aviśuddha-buddhayaḥ. Arūhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanty adhaḥ anādhṛta-yusmad-aṅghrayaḥ They are all impure. Their intelligence is not purified.

Dr. Patel: Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ

Prabhupāda: Ah. Now... Now here come in the... These people are moghāśā, moghāśā. Their all hopes will be frustrated. But another class, mahātmā. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha They take shelter of the spiritual energy.

Daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ. Because they..., the symptom is bhajanty ananya manasaḥ, "Hare Kṛṣṇa." They are not captivated by the so-called jñānīs, yogīs, karmīs. No. Simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is mahātmā.

Dr. Patel: Satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ

Prabhupāda: Yes. Again explained. Satataṁ kīrtayanto. That is their only business.

Dr. Patel: Namasyantaś ca māṁ bhaktyā nitya-yuktā upāsate.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is being done in every ISKCON center. Satataṁ kīrtayanto, chanting always "Kṛṣṇa," namasyantas, offering obeisances. Everything in Kṛṣṇa. This is mahātmā.

Dr. Patel: Yes.

Methods of worship and their results

BG 9.15ज्ञानयज्ञेन चाप्यन्ये यजन्तो मामुपासते ।एकत्वेन पृथक्त्वेन बहुधा विश्वतोमुखम् ॥१५॥jñāna-yajñena cāpy anyeyajanto mām upāsateekatvena pṛthaktvenabahudhā viśvato-mukhamOthers, who engage in sacriﬁce by the cultivation of knowledge, worship the Supreme Lord as the one without a second, as diverse in many, and in the universal form.

Here difficulty [Hindi].

Prabhupāda: Yes. Difficult [Hindi]. The jñāna-yajña [Hindi]. Indirectly. They are bhajante mām, but in a different way. And the mahātmās, those who are bhaktas, they are directly in the way. And they are indirectly, in this way.

Dr. Patel: Ekatvena pṛthaktvena bahudhā viśvato-mukham.

Prabhupāda: Ah. Ekatvena: "Now, I am, I am God."

Dr. Patel: Pṛthaktvena. Bahudhā viśvato-mukham. [Hindi]

Prabhupāda: Pantheism, pantheism. Bahudhā. Bahudhā means God has become pantheism.

Dr. Patel: All this. BG 9.16अहं क्रतुरहं यज्ञः स्वधाहमहमौषधम् ।मन्त्रोऽहमहमेवाज्यमहमग्निरहं हुतम् ॥१६॥ahaṁ kratur ahaṁ yajñaḥsvadhāham aham auṣadhammantro 'ham aham evājyamaham agnir ahaṁ hutamBut it is I who am the ritual, I the sacriﬁce, the offering to the ancestors, the healing herb, the transcendental chant. I am the butter and the ﬁre and the offering.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: "Everything is I."

Prabhupāda: "Everything is I." Because it is His energy, therefore He is. Śakti-śaktimator abhedaḥ. The energy and the energetic, they are identical.

BG 9.17पिताहमस्य जगतो माता धाता पितामहः ।वेद्यं पवित्रमोंकार ऋक्साम यजुरेव च ॥१७॥pitāham asya jagatomātā dhātā pitāmahaḥvedyaṁ pavitram oṁkāraṛk sāma yajur eva caI am the father of this universe, the mother, the support and the grandsire. I am the object of knowledge, the puriﬁer and the syllable oṁ. I am also the Ṛg, the Sāma and the Yajur Vedas.

Yes. "Everything, these Vedas, that I am." Vedaiś cāham, aham eva vedyaḥ So these... There are rascals, they claim that "We are Vedic student. We don't believe in Kṛṣṇa.

We don't believe in Bhagavad-gītā." You know this rascal society?

Dr. Patel: Mātā dhātā pitāmahaḥ. BG 9.18गतिर्भर्ता प्रभुः साक्षी निवासः शरणं सुहृत् ।प्रभवः प्रलयः स्थानं निधानं बीजमव्ययम् ॥१८॥gatir bhartā prabhuḥ sākṣīnivāsaḥ śaraṇaṁ suhṛtprabhavaḥ pralayaḥ sthānaṁnidhānaṁ bījam avyayamI am the goal, the sustainer, the master, the witness, the abode, the refuge and the most dear friend. I am the creation and the annihilation, the basis of everything, the resting place and the eternal seed."Everything is I. I am death as well as I am life."

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. BG 9.19तपाम्यहमहं वर्षं निगृह्णाम्युत्सृजामि च ।अमृतं चैव मृत्युश्च सदसच्चाहमर्जुन ॥१९॥tapāmy aham ahaṁ varṣaṁnigṛhṇāmy utsṛjāmi caamṛtaṁ caiva mṛtyuś casad asac cāham arjunaO Arjuna, I give heat, and I withhold and send forth the rain. I am immortality, and I am also death personiﬁed. Both spirit and matter are in Me.

Dr. Patel: He is sat and asat both.

Prabhupāda: Cause and effect.

Dr. Patel: Cause and effect. Now comes about the brāhmaṇa class who are making the yajñas. BG 9.20त्रैविद्या मां सोमपाः पूतपापायज्ञैरिष्ट्वा स्वर्गतिं प्रार्थयन्ते ।ते पुण्यमासाद्य सुरेन्द्रलोक-मश्नन्ति दिव्यान्दिवि देवभोगान् ॥२०॥trai-vidyā māṁ soma-pāḥ pūta-pāpāyajñair iṣṭvā svar-gatiṁ prārthayantete puṇyam āsādya surendra-lokamaśnanti divyān divi deva-bhogānThose who study the Vedas and drink the soma juice, seeking the heavenly planets, worship Me indirectly. Puriﬁed of sinful reactions, they take birth on the pious, heavenly planet of Indra, where they enjoy godly delights.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Svar-gatim, those who are desiring to go to the Svargaloka, heavenly planet, they go. They go...

Dr. Patel: And come back.

Prabhupāda: ...again come back. BG 9.21ते तं भुक्त्वा स्वर्गलोकं विशालंक्षीणे पुण्ये मर्त्यलोकं विशन्ति ।एवं त्रयीधर्ममनुप्रपन्नागतागतं कामकामा लभन्ते ॥२१॥te taṁ bhuktvā svarga-lokaṁ viśālaṁkṣīṇe puṇye martya-lokaṁ viśantievaṁ trayī-dharmam anuprapannāgatāgataṁ kāma-kāmā labhanteWhen they have thus enjoyed vast heavenly sense pleasure and the results of their pious activities are exhausted, they return to this mortal planet again. Thus those who seek sense enjoyment by adhering to the principles of the three Vedas achieve only repeated birth and death.Yes. But those who are devotees, they do not come back.

BG 9.21ते तं भुक्त्वा स्वर्गलोकं विशालंक्षीणे पुण्ये मर्त्यलोकं विशन्ति ।एवं त्रयीधर्ममनुप्रपन्नागतागतं कामकामा लभन्ते ॥२१॥te taṁ bhuktvā svarga-lokaṁ viśālaṁkṣīṇe puṇye martya-lokaṁ viśantievaṁ trayī-dharmam anuprapannāgatāgataṁ kāma-kāmā labhanteWhen they have thus enjoyed vast heavenly sense pleasure and the results of their pious activities are exhausted, they return to this mortal planet again. Thus those who seek sense enjoyment by adhering to the principles of the three Vedas achieve only repeated birth and death.

This is trayī-dharma, Vedic process. BG 9.22अनन्याश्चिन्तयन्तो मां ये जनाः पर्युपासते ।तेषां नित्याभियुक्तानां योगक्षेमं वहाम्यहम् ॥२२॥ananyāś cintayanto māṁye janāḥ paryupāsateteṣāṁ nityābhiyuktānāṁyoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy ahamBut those who always worship Me with exclusive devotion, meditating on My transcendental form – to them I carry what they lack, and I preserve what they have.That's all. The devotees, they do not care for anybody. Simply depending on Kṛṣṇa.

Therefore whatever necessities they require, Kṛṣṇa will supply.

Dr. Patel: Ye 'py anya-devatā-bhaktā yajante śraddhayānvitāḥ. [Hindi] Te 'pi mām eva kaunteya yajanty avidhi-pūrvakam Ahaṁ hi sarva-yajñānāṁ bhoktā ca prabhur eva ca, na tu mām abhijānanti tattva...

Prabhupāda: Yes. He is performing yajña. Just like the yajñic brāhmaṇa in Vṛndāvana. Kṛṣṇa went there and asked for some food. "Heh!"

Dr. Patel: They did not give.

Prabhupāda: They did not give.

Dr. Patel: Their wives gave.

Prabhupāda: All yajñic brāhmaṇas, like that. There are so many fools like that. They are thinking that "I am..., we are doing yajñas, I am doing this, I am doing that. What is this Kṛṣṇa? The Kṛṣṇa devotees are less intelligent.

They are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa." BG 9.24अहं हि सर्वयज्ञानां भोक्ता च प्रभुरेव च ।न तु मामभिजानन्ति तत्त्वेनातश्च्यवन्ति ते ॥२४॥ahaṁ hi sarva-yajñānāṁbhoktā ca prabhur eva cana tu mām abhijānantitattvenātaś cyavanti teI am the only enjoyer and master of all sacriﬁces. Therefore, those who do not recognize My true transcendental nature fall down.

Dr. Patel: Because they fall from the truth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because these people do not understand Kṛṣṇa tattvata, therefore they fall down. BG 9.25यान्ति देवव्रता देवान्पितॄन्यान्ति पितृव्रताः ।भूतानि यान्ति भूतेज्या यान्ति मद्याजिनोऽपि माम् ॥२५॥yānti deva-vratā devānpitṝn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥbhūtāni yānti bhūtejyāyānti mad-yājino 'pi māmThose who worship the demigods will take birth among the demigods; those who worship the ancestors go to the ancestors; those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth among such beings; and those who worship Me will live with Me.Ah, yes.

"Now, the devayājas, they can go to the heavenly planet. Pitṛs and śraddhā performer, they go Pitṛloka. Bhūtejyā, those who are worshiping this material world, they remain here.

But if one worships Me, he comes to Me."

Dr. Patel: "Come to Me in Goloka Vṛndāvana".

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything is open, but an intelligent person will think that "Why shall I go to Svargaloka? Why shall I remain here? Why shall I go to Pitṛloka?

Let me go direct to Kṛṣṇa." Yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama That is intelligent, to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, to take to Kṛṣṇa wholeheartedly. That is real intelligence. Otherwise mūḍha, whatever he may be.

Dr. Patel: Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati

Practical application of devotional service

Prabhupāda: Ah. And to satisfy Kṛṣṇa, it does not require any expensive material. If you have nothing to offer, you can offer patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ. He will be satisfied.

And performing this yajña and other, oh, you have got to collect so much ghee, so much grain, so much mantras, so many learned brāhmaṇas and this and that. You have nothing to do.

Anywhere, any part of the world, universal, any man, poor man, rich man, can offer Kṛṣṇa whatever he has got, Kṛṣṇa is satisfied.

Dr. Patel: Tad ahaṁ bhakty-upahṛtam

Prabhupāda: Ah. Bhaktya-upahṛtam aśnāmi prayatātmanaḥ. Yes. "Because he has offered Me with faith and devotion and love, I accept it." So when Kṛṣṇa eats something from your hand, then what remains? Again perfection.

All perfection is there. If Kṛṣṇa is accepting something from your hand, "Yes, I will eat it." Then? BG 9.27यत्करोषि यदश्नासि यज्जुहोषि ददासि यत् ।यत्तपस्यसि कौन्तेय तत्कुरुष्व मदर्पणम् ॥२७॥yat karoṣi yad aśnāsiyaj juhoṣi dadāsi yatyat tapasyasi kaunteyatat kuruṣva mad-arpaṇamWhatever you do, whatever you eat, whatever you offer or give away, and whatever austerities you perform – do that, O son of Kuntī, as an offering to Me.

Kuruṣva tad mad-arpaṇam. Therefore this is bhakti-yoga. Whatever you do, the result you give to Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: Whatever you do for Him, and forget about it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unless you do for Him, how you can give it? Because you are thinking that "I am doing for me," therefore you do not give to Kṛṣṇa. You keep it in your pocket.

Dr. Patel: Śubhāśubha-phalair evaṁ mokṣyase karma-bandhanaiḥ Ah, yat tapasyasi kaunteya tad kuruṣva mad-arpaṇam

Prabhupāda: Yes. Tapasi, tapasya. There are many, they are very much addicted to tapasya, suska tapasya. Śūṣka tapasya. There are many stages—unnecessarily starving, fasting unnecessarily.

Dr. Patel: Karṣanti mām.

Prabhupāda: Ah. Yes. This is going on. Why? Take Kṛṣṇa prasādam, be happy, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and dance. Susukhaṁ kartum avyayam Everything very nice to perform and very progressive, immediately. [Hindi]

BG 9.28शुभाशुभफलैरेवं मोक्ष्यसे कर्मबन्धनैः ।संन्यासयोगयुक्तात्मा विमुक्तो मामुपैष्यसि ॥२८॥śubhāśubha-phalair evaṁmokṣyase karma-bandhanaiḥsannyāsa-yoga-yuktātmāvimukto mām upaiṣyasiIn this way you will be freed from bondage to work and its auspicious and inauspicious results. With your mind ﬁxed on Me in this principle of renunciation, you will be liberated and come to Me.

Yes. Sannyāsa-yoga means sa sannyāsī, the one who acts for Kṛṣṇa, sa sannyāsī.

Dr. Patel: Sannyāsa-yoga-yuktātmā. Means you have actually, I mean, sannyāsa means nyāsa of all attachment toward the...

Prabhupāda: Nyāsa means giving up, giving up. Nyāsa. Sat nyāsa, sannyāsa. Oṁ tat sat. Sat is Kṛṣṇa. Therefore when you sacrifice everything for Kṛṣṇa, that is real sannyāsa, not this dress. This dress is symbolical. That's all.

Real thing is kāryaṁ karma karoti ya. Kāryam. "Oh, it is my... Kṛṣṇa wants everyone should surrender unto Him.

Then I shall teach everyone to surrender to Kṛṣṇa." Kāryam. "This is my business." Kāryaṁ karma karoti, sa sannyāsī. What is that kāryam? Kāryam means... This is kāryam.

Chandobhai: Yajñā dana tapa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya You'll take a practical.

My Guru Mahārāja gave me hint that "Book publication is more pleasing to me than maṭha-mandira." So I took it, and I began to publish books, and that has come successful.

Kāryaṁ karma. I took it, "Oh, Guru Mahārāja wants that books should be published. So let me concentrate on this instead of..." My creating so many centers, big, big temples, that is not my primary duty.

My primary duty is to write books. Therefore I am going on still. These are coming automatically. Maybe this is the secret of my success.

Dr. Patel: Sannyāsa-yoga-yuktātmā vimukto mām upaiṣyasi

Prabhupāda: Ah, karyam, that one should take the order of the guru, because guru is the representative of Kṛṣṇa. So when one takes... That is explained by Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura in connection with the verse,

BG 2.41व्यवसायात्मिका बुद्धिरेकेह कुरुनन्दन ।बहुशाखा ह्यनन्ताश्च बुद्धयोऽव्यवसायिनाम् ॥४१॥vyavasāyātmikā buddhirekeha kuru-nandanabahu-śākhā hy anantāś cabuddhayo 'vyavasāyināmThose who are on this path are resolute in purpose, and their aim is one. O beloved child of the Kurus, the intelligence of those who are irresolute is many-branched.

So the vyavasāyīs, those who are fixed up in the words of guru, so "Guru has ordered me to do it. Oh, that is my life. I do not know whether I will be promoted to heaven or hell. It doesn't matter. I shall execute."

Dr. Patel: Execute the order of the guru.

Prabhupāda: Guru. Yes. That is the secret. Yasya deve parā bhaktir tathā deve yathā gurau [ŚU 6.23]. Then he is sure to be successful. This is the secret.

BG 9.29समोऽहं सर्वभूतेषु न मे द्वेष्योऽस्ति न प्रियः ।ये भजन्ति तु मां भक्त्या मयि ते तेषु चाप्यहम् ॥२९॥samo 'haṁ sarva-bhūteṣuna me dveṣyo 'sti na priyaḥye bhajanti tu māṁ bhaktyāmayi te teṣu cāpy ahamI envy no one, nor am I partial to anyone. I am equal to all. But whoever renders service unto Me in devotion is a friend, is in Me, and I am also a friend to him.

Just see. They bhajanti, and these rascals has announced, "This bhajana is nuisance." Just see. This is Kali-yuga, and this is our Indian government. Ye bhajanti māṁ teṣam. He is always associating with God.

"I am always with him," ye bhajanti, and this rascal has remarked, "Bhajana nuisance." Catur-vidhā bhajante māṁ sukṛtino 'rjuna. These are the statements. But we are... We did not take any...

Dr. Patel: They are durācaris.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But we should have taken some step against this, the "Why you have said like this?" But nobody has taken.

Dr. Patel: But we are going to take steps. Let that man come. BG 9.30अपि चेत्सुदुराचारो भजते मामनन्यभाक् ।साधुरेव स मन्तव्यः सम्यग्व्यवसितो हि सः ॥३०॥api cet su-durācārobhajate mām ananya-bhāksādhur eva sa mantavyaḥsamyag vyavasito hi saḥEven if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Here... The first thing is one must have rigid, staunch faith in Kṛṣṇa. That is the qualification. Other things may be little deviation. It doesn't matter. The first thing is whether he is sticking to Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Then he is sādhu.

Dr. Patel: Ananya-bhāk.

Prabhupāda: Ananya-bhāk, yes. He has no other business.

Dr. Patel: Because he is samyag vyavasito, he is rightly doing. BG 9.31क्षिप्रं भवति धर्मात्मा शश्वच्छान्तिं निगच्छति ।कौन्तेय प्रति जानीहि न मे भक्तः प्रणश्यति ॥३१॥kṣipraṁ bhavati dharmātmāśaśvac-chāntiṁ nigacchatikaunteya pratijānīhina me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyatiHe quickly becomes righteous and attains lasting peace. O son of Kuntī, declare it boldly that My devotee never perishes.

Prabhupāda: "Although there are some bad habits," kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ, "because he is My devotee, he will not be lost. He will take to the right position."

Dr. Patel: I'll read this twice, and twice we are... BG 9.31क्षिप्रं भवति धर्मात्मा शश्वच्छान्तिं निगच्छति ।कौन्तेय प्रति जानीहि न मे भक्तः प्रणश्यति ॥३१॥kṣipraṁ bhavati dharmātmāśaśvac-chāntiṁ nigacchatikaunteya pratijānīhina me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyatiHe quickly becomes righteous and attains lasting peace. O son of Kuntī, declare it boldly that My devotee never perishes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Chandobhai: He has made a promise.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kaunteya pratijānīhi. He has not promised; He says Arjuna, that "You declare this." Because sometimes for His devotee He breaks His promise. But because His devotee Arjuna will promise, it will be never frustrated.

"Oh, My devotee has promised." Therefore He says, kaunteya pratijānīhi, "You do this." BG 9.32मां हि पार्थ व्यपाश्रित्य येऽपि स्युः पापयोनयः ।स्त्रियो वैश्यास्तथा शूद्रास्तेऽपि यान्ति परां गतिम् ॥३२॥māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśrityaye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥstriyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrāste 'pi yānti parāṁ gatimO son of Pṛthā, those who take shelter in Me, though they be of lower birth – women, vaiśyas [merchants] and śūdras [workers] – can attain the supreme destination.

Universal eligibility and scientific consciousness

BG 9.33किं पुनर्ब्राह्मणाः पुण्या भक्ता राजर्षयस्तथा ।अनित्यमसुखं लोकमिमं प्राप्य भजस्व माम् ॥३३॥kiṁ punar brāhmaṇāḥ puṇyābhaktā rājarṣayas tathāanityam asukhaṁ lokamimaṁ prāpya bhajasva māmHow much more this is so of the righteous brāhmaṇas, the devotees and the saintly kings. Therefore, having come to this temporary, miserable world, engage in loving service unto Me.

This is the conclusion, bhajasva mām. Again bhajana.

Dr. Patel: The highest... That is why we have come here.

Prabhupāda: Bhajasva mām. Again He's saying, bhajasva mām.

Dr. Patel: The highest comes now.

Prabhupāda: That is the highest...

Dr. Patel: Highest comes now. BG 9.34मन्मना भव मद्भक्तो मद्याजी मां नमस्कुरु ।मामेवैष्यसि युक्त्वैवमात्मानं मत्परायणः ॥३४॥man-manā bhava mad-bhaktomad-yājī māṁ namaskurumām evaiṣyasi yuktvaivamātmānaṁ mat-parāyaṇaḥEngage your mind always in thinking of Me, become My devotee, offer obeisances to Me and worship Me. Being completely absorbed in Me, surely you will come to Me.

Prabhupāda: You know, while commenting this verse, Dr. Radhakrishnan, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa." Just see. After reading so much he said, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa." Just see.

Mūḍha. [laughs] There is a Bengali proverb, sat-khanda rāmāyaṇa pāde, sitera na baba[?]. After reading the seven khandas...

Indian man: Yes, he's Bengali.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's all right.

After reading the whole Rāmāyaṇa he is asking, "Whose father is Sītā?" Similarly, this Dr. Radhakrishnan, after reading the whole chapter, he is advising, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa." Just see how much rascal he is.

And he is passing on as a great scholar.

Dr. Patel: I will re-read this three times. I will read this three times. Man-mana bhava-mad-bhakto. [goes on reading verse]

Prabhupāda: This is the conclusion.

Dr. Patel: "When completely yourself are settled in Me, you have got to come to Me. You can't go anywhere else." Again I will read the last. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī.

Prabhupāda: Very simple thing. You always think of Kṛṣṇa, man-manā; you become His devotee, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto; mad-yājī, worship Kṛṣṇa, and namaskuru. Where is the cost? No expenditure.

If you think of Kṛṣṇa, if you worship Kṛṣṇa, if you offer obeisances to Him... Therefore this Deity is there, for these purposes. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru

Simply by doing these four things, he is becoming liberated so much that he is going back to Godhead. That's all. [break] ...movement is very scientific movement, based on the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā. Most scientific. [break]

We may be proud. Because this is scientific, therefore it is so quickly progressing. [break] ...take. Within one cult. [break] ...so I was, that "I want to start this movement," I was talking.

So he very much appreciated, and he promised in writing that "As soon as I retire I shall join with you." He wrote me.

Dr. Patel: But then we have to tell him that "Come on, you are retiring. Join. And if you..."

Prabhupāda: That I wrote also. He was silent.

Dr. Patel: Now, you just tell him, "If you are following me here, there is one Dr. Patel who will take you." [break]

Prabhupāda: ...come for treatment. Why shall I come? [break] ...eight years old..., older than me. So I am seventy-eight.

Historical context and social systems

Maybe eighty-six. Yes. He was also of the same age. Older than me.

Dr. Patel: You were all the time in Allahabad. You must be knowing them from very close part.

Prabhupāda: No, he my customer. I used to go to his home. And he was coming to my shop. Yes. He was my customer.

When 1928 Congress was there, I sent him one letter that "I want to become a delegate and go there." So immediately, "Yes, you come." So I went to Calcutta and I told his secretary that "Panditji has told me like this." "Yes, take this ticket." Yes.

I became... So I was criticizing my friend, because the delegate fee is one rupee and the reception committee fee at that time was twenty-five rupees. And still, they were on the last seat.

And because at that time Motilal Nehru became president, the president..., the province in which the president becomes, that provincial member occupies the first seat. So we occupied the first seat from Allahabad. So I...

Dr. Patel: Front seats.

Prabhupāda: Front seat, yes. So I was criticizing my friends in Calcutta that "You have paid twenty-five rupees, you have got last seat. I have paid one rupee, I have first seat." We were very thickly...

Not very thickly, but as customer... Do you know? I shall tell one incident.

One day Jawaharlal Nehru came and he asked me, "Give me prophylactic hairbrush." So I told, "Panditji, we are selling prophylactic toothbrush, and we do not know that there is prophylactic hairbrush." "No, you do not know.

You get it for me. I want it." So I got it from Bombay, here, and supplied him.

Dr. Patel: There is no prophylactic hairbrush anywhere.

Prabhupāda: No, I got it, prophylactic hairbrush.

Dr. Patel: Somebody writes on it, on the name "prophylactic."

Prabhupāda: It may be whatever it may be. Now, just see that how much country conscious he was = he wants a tooth brush. Not only that. I will tell you another incident. I was manufacturing one medicine, jagon[?] poultice.

That is like anti-[indistinct]. So doctors were prescribing in Allahabad. So there was one big doctor, Dr. R. N. Banerjee, Rai Baba. So sometimes I was seeing the doctors.

So when I went there, "Oh, it is very difficult to prescribe country medicine." "Why?" "Oh, you will be surprised. I prescribed this jagon poultice in the Nehru family." He was physician.

"And Motilal Nehru said, 'Oh, doctor, excuse me. In the matter of medicine, don't prescribe country medicine.' " Just see. Believed in him.

Dr. Patel: Gandhiji was never asking anything for medicine much.

Prabhupāda: No, that is another thing. I know these people, this Nehru family. They were completely Europeanized. Outwardly [indistinct].

Even up to the last point of his life, if some European would come, he would immediately receive him. And if you Indian wants to see him, "Oh, it will be..." You will have to wait at least one...

Dr. Patel: He was conscious about the color.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything London-made is very good. That was Jawaharlal Nehru's idea.

Dr. Patel: Totally. Absolutely. It was a miracle, I think, the greatest miracle Calcutta has ever had.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He was... From very beginning of his birth, he is Englishman.

Dr. Patel: Right. He was not allowed to speak Bengali by his parents.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Dr. Patel: He was not allowed talking Bengali by his parents

Prabhupāda: Just see. And because in those days... [break]

Dr. Patel: We are forgetting Sanskrit very quickly.

Prabhupāda: No, no, those who are interested...

Dr. Patel: Now the schools, they don't teach as in our times. [break]

Prabhupāda: As soon as the kṣatriyas were negligent, immediately the brāhmaṇas should take step. That was the system. [break]

...offer advice to the kṣatriyas according to śāstra, and kṣatriyas would execute, and the vaiśyas would care for supply. And the śūdras, serving everyone. That's all. This is the system. [break] So he used to manufacture.

To manufacture means śūdra.

Dr. Patel: I see. [end]