Class for Brahmachari
Бхакти Вигьяна Госвами · Дели · 2025
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Invocational prayers and opening chants
Oh Mayanati Mirandasya, Janam Jana Chalakayachurum Militamy, Tasmay Shrigu Ravenamaha. Sri Chaita, Stapi Damien, Butle, Swaamrupayam. Dati Swapadtikam Vandiham Sri Guru Sritapadakama Lam, Sri Guru Nvaisnavam sha sriupa
sagrajatamatam vitam Sivam, Sadvatam Sadhutam, Paridana Sahitam, Krishna Chaitanyade, Sri Krishna Padam, Saganalita, Sri Visaka Vitams Krishna Karuna Sindho Dinabandu Jagatpate Gopisha Gopikakanta
Radakantamastute Taptakanchanagurangi, Rade Vrindavaneshwari Vrisavanu Sudevi Pranamami Hari Pri, Vanchakalpatarubescha, Kripasindubecha, Patitanampavaneby, Vaishnavyamonam, Sri Krishna Chaitana Praboniananda,
Sri Dvaitagadara, Srivassadigura Bakta Vrinda Hekishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Rama Rama Ramahare Hare Krishna
Hare Krishna Krishna Krishnaarehare, Ramaare, Rama, Rama Ramahare Hare. Yontah Pravishya Mamavachamam Prasuptam Sanji Vayatakila Shakti Darah Swadamna Anjamasravanatva Gadim Pranannamu Bhagavate Purushayatubam Swasyastu
Vishwasya Kalah Prasidatam, Dyantu Butani Shivam Mithodya, Manaschavadram Bajatata Doksaj Avisha Tamnomati Ratya Tukimprava Janta Manupetamapeta Krityam dwaipaya no virahakatara Juhava,
Putreitand Mayatayotaravou Binedus, Tam Sarva Budakridayam Mu Nima Tosmi Hare
Remaining enthusiastic in spiritual life
Krishna. Thank you very much for inviting me. I am very enthused to be with all of you. You're all enthused by His Holiness Srila Gopal Krishna Maharaj.
And one of his mottoes was remain brahmachari, don't go into grihastha. We all know this.
And uh one requires a lot of enthusiasm and also spiritual realization to remain in Brahmacharyasram. And I'll speak a little bit about this topic and we'll open for discussion.
So I'll speak a little bit about the crisis uh which uh we will have to face uh in our spiritual path. Sometimes we are very, uh, enthused by Śrīla Prabhupāda's assurance that spiritual life is very easy and simple.
And Śrīla Prabhupāda and his desire to inspire everyone to take spiritual life, he would say that's just eat prasādaṁ and dance and then we will find ourselves back home, back to Godhead. We will dance our way there.
Yes, and we dance, dance, dance, and then somehow or other something breaks and we find ourselves not dancing anymore. There is no doubt about it. Spiritual life is a in bhakti. Bhakti is a relatively easy path.
It's a sometimes Śrīla Prabhupāda said, it's a royal path to God. It's a very direct. And uh sometimes Śrīla Prabhupāda compare bhakti with elevator.
If you go by staircase, it may be a little difficult, you know, you have to climb over one stair, another stair, and then you're there. But still we have to be aware that there will be difficulties in our spiritual life.
Various kind of difficulties.
In the beginning we are very enthusiastic, but then spiritual life becomes a little boring, it's the same, same Mangalarati, same Hare Krishna mantra, same lectures, same prasadam, everything is the same.
Because if you're brahmacārī you travel here and there and you get some different prasādaṁ that may give you some different taste. But uh We have to admit that difficulties are there.
And actually, Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura Prabhupāda said that in Kali Yuga, the path of bhakti uh is uh has so many obstacles like all the kaṇṭakas, all the thorns are there on the path of bhakti.
The process of spiritualizing ego
Let's analyze scientifically what's going on when we are practicing bhakti and why in one sense the crises or difficulties are inevitable. What is bhakti?
The pass of bhakti is the path of gradual transformation of our ego. At this moment of time, this is very beautifully described by Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura in his Madhurya-kadambini that the bhakti is different from jnana.
Because on the path of jnana you're supposed to give up your ego. You're supposed to eradicate your ego. No ego anymore. I am nobody. I am Brahman. Aham Brahmasmi, no individual, no individuality, no aham, no mama.
But uh Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura explains that sadhu bhakti is the path of spiritualization of our Aham and Mama. Our ego has these two aspects.
Our conception of who is I, what what what I am and then subsequent conception of my relationship with the things of this world which creates mama, my possession, whatever belongs to me,
which becomes the extension of my I.
So there is I, I am this, I am that, I am brahmacārī, I am gṛhastha, I am sannyāsī, I am brāhmaṇa, I'm kṣatriya, I'm husband of such and such woman. So many different conceptions of who I am.
And the extension of this: this is my wife, this is my children, this is my house, this is my temple, this is my little brahmacārī tilaka or whatever, whatever brahmacārī has.
So everyone has these two aspects, Aham and Mama, and on the path of bhakti uh there is uh a transition between the material Aham and Mama, material conception of I and Mine, and spiritual conception of I and Mine.
Ultimately, the path of Bhakti is the path of spiritualization of Aham and Mama. And uh it uh uh it's not uh an immediate process. It's very easy to say, "I am not this body, I am the servant of the Lord," yes.
Gopi-bhartuḥ pada-kamalayor dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ. That's very easy to say.
To feel that I am the servant of the Lord and I am dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ of the gopi-bhartuḥ pada-kamala, the, uh, of the husband or the lover of all the gōpīs, to feel like this, it's not so easy.
It's easy to say, it's not easy to feel. We still feel I am this body. You can say this beautiful mantra, I am not this body, sixteen rounds a day. I am not this body, I am not this body, I am not this body.
As soon as you find yourself in front of the mirror, you immediately forget all this 16 rounds of I am not this body mantra. You're this body. This is me. This is my nose. This is this is me. This is I am.
So and the process of changing the consciousness is gradual. That we have to understand very clearly, that this is not immediate process. And even on the very high stages, like there
He was a story of one disciple of Śrīla Prabhupāda. He was very enthusiastic and very much convinced by the statements of Śrīla Prabhupāda, I'm not this body. And he imagined himself to be a great yogi.
So he needed to have some little operation, he had some boil in his somewhere and the boil has to be removed.
And he came to a doctor, and the doctor said, okay, so I'll do some little anesthesia to remove the pain and then I'll do operation. And he said, no, no, no, I don't need anesthesia. I'm not this body. I am not this body.
Do it like this. I I I don't care. Doctor said, are you sure? He said, yes, I'm sure. So he took the knife and he put it. Ah. So all the philosophy was forgotten at the same moment. Very quickly it was.
All the remnants of philosophy were removed from his consciousness because the bodily identification is so strong. And realization is not coming immediately, it's coming in instalments. It's coming little by little.
Gradual stages of devotional transformation
And that's exactly what Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura is explaining. And he's explaining that this spiritualization of ego takes
its a gradual process, and only on the level of premā when you have all-consuming life of God, love of God, you completely forget about this body. You don't care.
Ragunat Das Gaswami, he only took just a little cup of buttermilk every other day, and he didn't need more.
It's not that he was taking a little cup of the buttermilk and he was thinking it would be good to have some pizza or something like this. He couldn't care about everything.
He just was completely happy because he was happy internally. He had this deep internal realization, but that happens only on the level of premā or level of bhāva.
It's very interesting that Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura says that on the level of sādhana-bhakti, when we are practicing bhajana Kriya.
When we're chanting regulated number of rounds, when we're doing kṣaya-sādhanā, going to Mangalarati, he says that the spiritualization of ego is Ekadeshavartini, it basically means five percent or less.
Ekādeśavartinī means it's little bit tiny tiny little bit of figure spiritualized but the the absorption in the matter is purna, complete.
We are doing sadhana, we are chanting 16 rounds or whatever number of rounds we are chanting. Still, our consciousness is fully absorbed in the matter. And little, little spiritualization started.
And then he says on the level of Nishta, it's little more spiritualized, and the absorption is little weakened on the level of रुचि, it's more complete, and then gradually, gradually it goes on.
But in the beginning stages, the consciousness is still very much absorbed in the matter. When we have some little pain in the body or some headache or whatever, it's very difficult to chant the Holy Name.
We chant the Holy Name, but our consciousness is not in the holy name. Even if there is no pain in the body, still our consciousness is not in the holy name.
Our consciousness is in the body and what is happening in the body. So and uh the changes, the human beings are uh designed in such a way that we kind of find the comfort zone in any condition.
And the change fromrom this comfort zone is always very difficult. It's not easy. It's like you're moving from this temple to this new place. And it's a difficult transition, right?
I saw the you know garbage which is there in the courtyard, all kinds of stuff there. You know it's it's difficult to move.
You are uh nicely situated in one place, you're comfortable there, you know everything, and now you have to move somewhere else, and it's it's a headache. It's a big headache to change the position.
So, and that's exactly why it's so difficult to change the body. The body why people are so afraid of dying.
Even those people who know I'm I'm not, you know, the soul is eternal, still, it's very difficult for them to die. For the most people, it's it's difficult.
It's a very difficult transition because we already found a comfort zone in this body.
We already know everything. We are more or less familiar with everything which we are supposed to do. And transition again is always a very difficult process. So any transition in our life implies that we leave behind the comfort zone.
And we come to a new place which is totally unknown for us and therefore it's very scary. And it's a little difficult. What are we going to do, how we're going to be there? You know, can you imagine?
You have to be Śrīla Prabhupāda, to leave behind, as Śrīla Prabhupāda used to say, I was very comfortable in Vṛndāvana. Of course when we go to Rādhā-Dāmodara temple and see his little tiny room in Rādhā-Dāmodara temple without attached bathroom, we ask ourselves how he was comfortable here.
But the idea was that he knew everything there. He was very familiar with how it works and he was very comfortable because...
And, you know, can you imagine how difficult it was for Śrīla Prabhupāda to leave everything behind and to go to America. He didn't know anything what is going to happen in America. Without even money.
You know, I wouldn't go to America without money. Nobody, no sane person would go to America without money.
It's not like India where you know there is free food distribution on every corner, you know. You go and where there is a lot of garbage, this means free food distribution is going on. In America it's not a custom.
So he left everything behind. He went to America. Why? Because he was not bodily conscious. He was not afraid. He was āśrita-caraṇāravinda and therefore it was not difficult for him to go through this transition.
But for those of us and I believe that most of us are in this category, who are not on the level of premā. I may be mistaken, maybe I'm talking with a bunch of prema-bhaktas. I don't know.
But for those who are just practicing bhakti, especially in initial stages of sādhana-bhakti, bhajana-kriyā,
Transitioning through spiritual development stages
the transitions are difficult and it's leaving behind the comfort and going into some unknown place or unknown situation. Not literally but, unknown from the point of view of the soul. So that's why all these uh crisis are taking place.
And that's exactly what is being described by Vishwanachakravati Thakur and by Rūpa Gosvāmī too. And he says that, and we all know, we all have experience.
In the beginning, when we become interested in Krishna consciousness, we have some initial interest in Krishna consciousness. It's a big step from the initial interest to Krishna consciousness
to move to the temple, to move to an āśrama. It's a big step. You have to you have to be bold enough and it's uh sometimes it's uh it's not an easy transition uh to go.
I remember when uh uh I was living in Russia as uh uh Prabhu uh who was introducing me said.
And it was difficult, but it was much more difficult for me when I moved to Sweden, because I moved from my comfortable situation at home.
Yes, I was harassed by KGB, by secret police, I was interrogated, this and that, but still I was quite comfortable there. That's how human consciousness works.
Whatever is familiar, he becomes very comfortable in this situation. But then I moved to Sweden, nobody was harassing me, but my mind was harassing me.
Because everything was new, everything was I had to live in an āśrama all of a sudden, and I had to put my Tilak and, before that I didn't know how to put my Tilak. I still remember how difficult it was to put Tilak for the first time in my life.
So, in any case, the point is that when we're transiting from initial śraddhā to commitment to guru, to sādhu-saṅga, when we are listening to guru, when we are taking initiation, it basically means we're taking the vows, when we start practicing, there are some transition points of it.
And what I want to say is that if we know that this is going to come, that we will make these steps and that what is going to happen it will be easier for now for us to go through one step
and to another just yesterday I was in Prayāgrāja. And one devotee approached me and he said that I'm already practicing Krishna consciousness for 15 years. I am living in brahmacārī-āśrama, I am a leader here.
But I feel like I was more Krishna conscious in the beginning than I am now. Because in the beginning I was very careful, I was not offending anyone. I was very afraid to offend anyone.
I was very afraid of an aparādha. But now I don't I'm not afraid at all. I'm and uh I'm kind of you know used to everything and I feel stuck. So this feeling of getting stuck somewhere in the mud of Krishna consciousness.
I don't know if it's the correct expression, mud of Krishna consciousness, but it's probably not just mad, it's Gopichandana. But still you feel stuck. You feel you're not moving, you're not progressing.
You feel that something is something is wrong, but at the same time uh you're not bold enough. You're not courageous courageous enough to make it the next step. That's the condition of crisis which uh we all have to face.
And sometimes Krishna will have to use some extreme measures to kick us out from the comfortable situation. Krishna is very expert in kicking people out, you know from from the from the place where they stuck in the mud.
Elevating standards of devotional practice
So uh so So Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, please listen very carefully. He says very interesting thing. He says that he explains this dynamic of how we should progress from one stage to another.
He says that in each and every stage of spiritual development, there are certain rules and regulations uh which we have to follow. By rules and regulations, Bhaktivinoda doesn't mean very general rules, no meat eating.
This is for all the stages of spiritual development. But there are more subtle rules which we have to follow.
And he says that as soon as you feel that the practice of bhakti on this particular stage becomes very easy to you. You become very comfortable in this particular situation. It's very easy for you.
In the beginning it was difficult, but then you kind of become very comfortable with this. 16 rounds, no problem. Then you have to raise your rules which you follow.
You have to raise the level uh of the you know you you have to do more.
If you don't do more, then you will not progress and if you don't leave something which was there behind, if you don't leave the level of the rules which uh which were there before, and don't go further, then you're basically stuck on this level.
And being on this level without moving further, what you will do, you will criticize those people who are higher than you.
To justify that you are on this level. He says it's very important to leave behind the standard which you're doing before, increase your standard, and then and always be in own reverence for those people who are higher than you.
So it's like if you're going to some gym or whatever. If you're too comfortable in the place which you are doing, then you will never develop further.
So this sense that I'm developing, whatever it is, it may be the number of the rounds or some more difficult vows according to the level of our qualification. We have to gradually increase our level of sadhana.
We have to go deeper and deeper and deeper, otherwise, inevitably we will just feel that I'm stuck and we will feel some sort of emptiness inside.
Yes, I did this like this devotee who was confessing to me that before he was much more Krishna conscious now.
He said, I feel kind of emptiness because, uh, uh because nothing new is coming to me and there is no new realizations, new experience which I get.
We can take example, of course, very glorious example of Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāj. I remember very clearly once I called Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāj, it was late, but I knew that he would never go to bed very early.
So it was probably nine o'clock at night or, uh, half past nine. And I was calling him, I so there was something urgent. I wanted to ask him something.
I don't remember what was it, but there was some urgent question which I wanted to ask him. And he was driving from Delhi to Chandigarh to be in time for a yatra next day.
And, uh, I called him and I, uh, asked something and Gopāla Kṛṣṇa started chuckling and he said, I am semi-retired. You know, at 10 o'clock at night he's driving from Delhi to Chandigarh and he's saying I'm semi-retired.
So he never retired. He was always, you know, getting more and more and more on his shoulders. He was always increasing his level of devotional service. That's an amazing example how he was dealing with this.
His level of devotional service was he never stopped increasing the level of devotional service, increasing his commitment, increasing his you know the things which he is doing.
So, and that's because he was personally trained by Śrīla Prabhupāda himself. And Śrīla Prabhupāda was like this: he would never be self-complacent, and he would never allow his disciples to be self-complacent.
As soon as somebody like Tamal Krishna Maharaj is another good example, Tamal Krishna Maharaj was a big book distributor and, you know, he was the head of this Radha-Damodara Party, and the Radha-Damodara Party was extremely successful and they had many many how many dozens of this big buses and they were traveling, distributing thousands, tens of thousands of books.
And Śrīla Prabhupāda just calls him and says, go to China. Just leave everything behind. Go to China. Go to completely unknown place. And he had to surrender. And it was difficult for him. And it's always difficult.
And if our life is not difficult, something is wrong with our spiritual life.
If we're not taking new difficulties, if we're not going deeper in whatever commitment we have, it means that we're stuck in some place and uh we may be comfortable for some time, we may be a little sleepy and it's okay, it's fine, uh it's good, yeah.
I I somehow or other I managed to get up at 4 30 uh in the morning because I have two hours of sleep during the day after lunch so no problem for me or something like this.
But the point is that uh As a result, we will feel empty. We will feel totally dissatisfied with our spiritual life. And the main point, we will cheat ourselves.
Śrīla Prabhupāda said that it's not easy for people it's not easy to cheat people, but it's very easy for people to cheat themselves. Self-deception mechanisms are very deep rooted.
We may think that I'm progressing, but the goal of Krishna consciousness is still very far away from me. And we have to be remembered, we have to be reminded about this.
Actually, every Bhagavatam class we have to be reminded that we have to go further. We have to go further. We have to go further.
Focus on love of Krishna
Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī in Bhakti-sandarbha, he gives a very beautiful example. He says how to recognize śāstrīya-śraddhā. What is the.
He gives a few characteristics, few lakṣaṇas of śāstrīya-śraddhā. When you have deep śraddhā, deep faith into śāstra, it means that you have deep commitment to the picture of reality depicted in śāstra. You know Krishna is in charge and Krishna is God and you know this sambandha-jñāna. You have deep commitment to the process which is depicted in the śāstra.
But first and foremost, you're deeply devoted to the goal of śāstra. I want to achieve kṛṣṇa-prema.
Sometimes I noticed devotees after Mangalarati before chanting Hare Krishna mantra and they chant or they repeat ten offenses against the holy name, not to forget any offenses so that they would commit all of them all ten of them and
and at the end they say, you know, and one have to be very careful and guard against this offenses to achieve the goal. And then all together they have to chant Krishna Prema.
It was supposed to be chanted with full of enthusiasm, but I noticed that usually Krishna prayers sound like a real goal.
Whereas we have to be reminded again and again and again, this is the goal of what we are doing. The goal of what we are doing is nothing material, it's just to transform completely
our ego to become, uh, gopī-bhartuḥ pada-kamalayor dāsa- dāsānudāsa, to become a completely self-oblivious servant of the gopis or of Krishna who is the master of the Gopis.
So this is, and this is what I want to say that this crisis is the crisis of the change of our ego and the change of ego, the what is the sign of the crisis.
Actually, this is described in the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. Bhagavad-gītā starts from the description of crisis. What is the first chapter of Bhagavad-gītā?
Arjuna, who was very comfortable in his position before, he was the best uh bowman, he was the best archer, uh the best fighter, very successful, this and that. All of a sudden he becomes weak. All of a sudden he becomes depressed.
And Śrīla Prabhupāda says, and he starts trembling, he describes all the symptoms, physical symptoms which he experiences. And Śrīla Prabhupāda says, this is the symptom of fear.
And again, as I said in the beginning, to come from one stage to another, one experiences the fear.
It's difficult to go from the comfortable place to another place where it's completely unknown and uh it is very nicely described in Bhagavad-gītā that Arjuna becomes fearful, and what he starts doing, he starts deceiving himself.
He starts rationalizing: I'm okay. Everything which is going on is good because I don't want to kill these people. He explains through the medium of śāstra. He quotes śāstra.
He says, this is, you know, he explains that about varṇa- śaṅkara and kula-dharma sanātana, destruction of the family traditions and this and that, he explains. And Krishna just, you know, he just smiles. He smiles.
He doesn't say anything. Because he knows that he's cheating himself. He's trying to cheat himself and he's trying to cheat Krishna. But you cannot cheat Krishna. You can cheat yourself, but you cannot cheat Krishna.
And therefore, Krishna just smiles. Yes. Very good, very good. Very nice. You're a very nice devotee. Very nice, no problem.
But then he says, okay, this is just the śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ tvāṁ prapannam, please tell me what to do. I am surrendered soul.
Immediately he says, śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ tvāṁ prapannam, I am the soul surrendered unto you, please teach me. And then he says, na yotsya iti go. So that's a very interesting statement.
You know, I'm surrendered soul, but I'm not going to fight. So that's the exactly the situation of crisis. I'm going to do, but only within these limits.
But then somebody has to come to you and tell you, please, Prabhu, you are stuck in the matter of Krishna consciousness. You have to go further. You have to do something.
So and uh uh as I said uh it's uh it's uh difficult transition uh going through these crises.
Six substages of unsteady practice
What I wanted to tell a little bit more about is to niṣṭhā. Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura says that on the stage of aniṣṭhitā bhajana-krīyā There are six substages. One is utsāhamayī, one is overly enthusiastic, too much
One is Utsahamay, one is overly enthusiastic, too much
enthusiastic in the beginning, then ghana-taralā, then he became a little mechanical in his following bhakti. In the beginning, everything is nice, everything is fine, and he really feels I'm
almost there on the level of prema. Prahlādānanda Mahārāja very humorously depicts how he wrote his first letter to Śrīla Prabhupāda.
He was at that time, he was in the temple, he was a student in a a university in Buffalo, and there was a batch of devotee students, and he started living in the temple.
And he said, after six months living in the temple, I wrote to Śrīla Prabhupāda my first letter to him. And I said, Śrīla Prabhupāda, thank you very much. You gave us this beautiful Krishna consciousness.
I ever I understand everything about Krishna consciousness.
The only one little doubt or misunderstanding which I have, how the transition between the stage of bhāva to the stage of premā takes place. Please explain this to me. So everything else is clear to me.
How to come from bhāva to premā, that's not yet clear. And the implication is there. I'm only on the level of bhāva, so please help me out to achieve premā. I'm almost there.
So the idea is that in the beginning we are very enthusiastic and we feel that yeah yeah it's coming, it's coming, it's very close.
But then it becomes very, you know uh same thing at the same time, kind of mechanistic sadhana. And then vyūḍha-vikalpa.
Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura describes that one starts uh his mind starts wavering from one thing to another thing. Should I get married or should I remain brahmacharya or should I get married
or should I remain brahmacārī? And he finds the proper quotes from the Shastra for every position which uh which he needs to justify. This is good, no and then he thinks no this is good, and then again.
So vyūḍha-vikalpa, this kind of wavering of the mind when the mind is unstable and uh and basically it's the it's betraying the condition of this satisfaction inside.
That there is no deep, deeply rooted satisfaction, which is natural because in the beginning stages the spiritual practice does not bring satisfaction or require satisfaction.
And then he says, viṣaya-saṅgarā, when one feels very strong urges of the senses and he wants to enjoy the senses and then vyūḍha-vikalpa.
Vyūḍha-vikalpa, then viṣaya-saṅgarā, then niyamān-niyama. So he uh he's trying to give uh to increase his uh bhakti, his level of commitment but it doesn't work.
And ultimately, taraṅga-raṅgiṇī. That's the last uh uh stage of unstable practice of bhakti. When we are already quite stable in bhakti.
We chant our rounds, it's easy, it's not difficult, and we are we have some sort of influence over other people, we preach to other people, we inspire other people by our example.
Transitioning from unsteady practice to stability
But from this stage to go to niṣṭhā stage, it's a very difficult transition.
Because niṣṭhā means tṛṇād api su-nīcena taror iva sahiṣṇunā amānī mānadena kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ. And Tarangarangini means I'm senior devotee. So from senior devotee to Trinadapi stage, it's a very painful transition.
Because in doing our sadhana bhakti, we create some sort of uh pseudha spiritual identity I am this or I am that. In terms of our, you know, whatever hierarchy may have.
I may be this senior devotee, that senior devotee, counselor, temple president, whatever it is, it doesn't matter. Sannyasi, uh even guru.
And uh I do this and I enjoy doing this. But this is not yet purely spiritual enjoyment.
Purely spiritual enjoyment only comes on the level of Trinada Pisunichinatarora Pisa Hishana Manina When I'm ready to chant the holy name 24 hours a day and I don't need anything else.
We're still being in some position, in some position of authority, in some position of influence, by influencing others, we are preaching to others, and that's good. It's necessary.
But when we become too much, when we too much identify ourselves with this position, when this position becomes another upadi.
When I feel that I am this, I don't feel that I am just little tiny spirit soul which wants to be in love with Krishna,
but I again identify oneself with the role, with external role which I am playing, according to my position in the society, in the ashram, in the Iskon, and whatever it is.
And then it's it's very difficult to go beyond this uh to to uh the stage of NISTA because in the stage of NISTA uh you don't have any external uh identification or external protections, whatever is there, you very clearly understand it's my role.
So the difference between one stage and another stage, in both places you're playing the role. You're playing certain role according to the situation.
But uh in the stage of Anishita Bhajana Kriya, uh you like this role and you think I am this role, I am this. But in the stage of Nishta, you very clearly understand I am not this.
This is just my role which I have to do to properly behave, to show the example to others, to to perform my duties. But ultimately I'm not this. Ultimately I'm something much deeper.
So this is what and this is not this is not easy. Like today I was introduced as the GBC member. I am not a GBC member for already seven years. I was on the GBC for 21 years.
And all the time when I was on GBC I felt that yeah, this is my service. But then at one point some crisis came to my life and I faced that I have to change something and I decided that I should resign from the GBC.
And I still very clearly remember this point. I wrote a letter of resignation to the GBC and I felt pain. I never thought that I'm attached to this position of GBC. I thought, yes, I am just doing it as a service.
But when I resigned from it, I realized I am attached to this position. I am somehow rather that has become part of my identity. That has become part of me,
which basically means or implies that I'm still I still have material identity.
So in the beginning, when we just practice Krishna consciousness, it's okay to perform our duties nicely, we have to identify with the roles when doing this.
But to go from the level of unstable bhava to stable bhava, where the bhava becomes the essence of my of my soul, of my understanding who I am.
We have to relinquish all these false identities which we created so carefully through our career in devotional service. And sometimes it may be it may be associated with some drastic change in our life. It may not be.
It's not necessarily like this, but internally this transition has to take place. I'm not all of this.
I am just a servant of the servant of the servant. All these external designations which are there, even if it is designations uh in regard to uh devotional service are not really important and I'm just a servant and I want to serve and I want to chant.
Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare / Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare Ram 24 hours a day.
Embracing difficulties for spiritual advancement
Or at least to be absorbed in Krishna consciousness for uh all the time.
So that's uh that's what I wanted to say that this uh we have to be uh aware uh that change of ego is uh not easy, uh but it has to take place. And to facilitate this change of ego we have to always uh develop in our Krishna consciousness. Our sadhana should never be sleepy sadhana.
It should never be nidra bhajanakriya. It should never be just comfortable mechanistic sadhana. We have to have all the time challenges and if the challenges are there, uh then uh uh uh we will do more.
And if we look very carefully in our scriptures we will see the
descriptions of these critical situations everywhere. Bhagavad-gītā, as I said, starts with this critical situation when Arjuna was going from one condition of consciousness into another condition of consciousness to become the perfect instrument in Krishna's hands and there
are some other instances in our scriptures which describe how the difficulties which we experience actually the blessings which are sent to the Lord for us to go further.
So sometimes devotees they don't understand the prayer of Queen Kunti when she says, please send to me the difficulties again and again and again.
Let all this vipat the difficulties which you are sending to me become my sampad, my wealth. She's basically saying this, this is what how Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura comments on this verse.
He says, she's asking: actually, all the difficulties which you sent to me has become my vipat, uh, my my sampad, my my wealth. Why?
Because uh after undergoing all these difficulties uh from following from one stage to another, I uh I became uh deeper and deeper and deeper in my Krishna consciousness. My love towards you increased with every difficulty which I managed to overcome.
So that's my little message to you. Difficulties will come to your life. And don't be afraid of these difficulties. Embrace these difficulties with a lot of joy and enthusiasm.
Remember about Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja, how he embraced all the difficulties which he faced. And he faced immense difficulties in his spiritual life. And please have his uh amazing example always in front of your eyes.
Because Yeah. clearly, like in the last stages of his life, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja has become uh the experience of being with him. It's very difficult to compare it with anything else.
I felt physically the bliss which he experiences himself. We all know how difficult his physical situation was, but despite of all the physical difficulty, he was extremely blissful and he was emanating the bliss.
He was exuding the bliss. Why?
Only because he was taking difficulties and going through all these difficulties and was grateful in every stage of the difficulty, grateful for Krishna, to Krishna for every difficulty which he sent to him.
So anyway, my my little talk was somewhat chaotic from all over the place, but I think I gave the main message to you. Don't be afraid of difficulty. Ask for difficulties. Pray for difficulties.
And by the mercy of Guru and Krishna you will be able to overcome those difficulties and be rewarded by genuine Krishna consciousness.
Because without difficulties, it's not possible to overcome all the internal difficulties which we have. Without external difficulties, it's not possible to overcome the internal obstacles which every one of us has.
And all the external difficulties are sent to us to help us to overcome the internal obstacles within our heart.
Balancing practical service with sadhana
Thank you very much, Hare Krishna. Yes. Yes. Thank you, Maharaj. Very very deep class. I'm uh I think I have filled approximately ten pages. Means less than that. I have four questions. Okay. So one I will answer. Okay.
Why you once in uh in between you told that we have to go deeper in our sadhana level. So does this statement also include our seva, physical service? Absolutely, yes. Absolutely yes.
So generally, in our mature stage, we have a conflicting understanding of seva and sadhana. Once we are overoccupied in our physical external services and our sadhana is impacted due to that. Balance gets out of shift.
And so going deeper in sadhana uh practically implies many times to get a break from our active seva. So how can we sustainably implement it? Um everyone has to find his own balance.
There is no mechanical formula or universal formula of balance because this balance between the active service and sadhana is different uh on different stages of our development, different for different people with different svabhavas, different, you know, initial stages of their development, then their natures. Somebody is more active by nature, somebody is more introverted by nature, somebody is less introvert, more extrovert, somebody more extrovert, uh extrovert. So uh it's um there is no universal formula and even in our own life this formula will be changing, but the balance has to be there.
The balance which is like very general balance which is recommended in Vedic scriptures, can be derived from the understanding that sannyasis in the days of yore they were traveling eight months a year and four months a year they were sitting in one place and they were studying Shastra. So that was the custom.
They usually Chaturmas was the place was the time when the sannyasis would come together in one place and they would do shastra seva. They would go deeper into shastra.
It doesn't mean that we have to follow Chaturmas. Srila Prabhupada never instituted Chaturmas for us.
But it means that for them, for sannyasis, two thirds of the time they were uh actively engaged uh in the service and traveling, especially in those days was you know very active engagement.
And uh one third, so two-thirds of the time they were engaged in active service and one third they were engaged in internal sadhana.
So this kind of rough ratio uh could be an indication, but again, as I said, it could be different for different people in different stages.
And sometimes you know we need uh We need some times when we are completely absorbed in spiritual practice, otherwise we will never feel satisfaction from spiritual practice.
This is what explained by Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura in Harinama Chintamani. He says when you chant holy name with the offences, what is the remedy from the offenses?
He says that if you chant holy name with offenses the remedy is you take the day off like Ekadashi or Janmashtami Day or whatever.
Of course Janmashtimi Day is probably not a good day for for sadhana in your case. It's probably very busy day. But uh you take a day and you completely absorb yourself in only in chanting and not doing anything else.
And then in this way you rejuvenate your taste for uh the holy name. Uh you completely renew your taste and your commitment. You forget about everything else and just do kirtan and hear and chant.
So every now and then you have to do this, ekādaśī is a good day or according to the schedule, according to your particular seller. But uh my advice is that first of all, uh every now and then such days have to be there.
When you're completely absorbed in sadhana, and try to come in contact with the essence of the spiritual practices.
And another one is that yeah, find your proper balance between the practical service and uh and sadhana either during the day, when the first part is completely devoted to spiritual practice and then you try to actively serve or during the week or during the
months, there has to be certain balancing uh you know periods when uh when you feel that you're too much passionate and you're doing too much mm practical service and you're suddenly suffering then you have to do something.
It's incumbent to you. My question was something similar to what you said. And uh before my question I have one uh I mean a comment or the since you
spoke about the Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaj and the way he conducted his spiritual life and increased his commitments over never retired from expanding his devotional service.
So my question at this point is that my impression of like
over 28 years of association with Bhakti Vikasa Maharaj as a disciple is that Maharaj and first of all even thank you for what you said and it made a lot of meaning.
And I got a lot of memories of Maharaj was coming the way Maharaj conducted and what Maharaj was giving him both ways.
So Maharaj is to push uh I mean really hard for practical services and institutional commitments and my impression again he would also award the excellence you know if some devotees uh do some achieve wonderful results in Krishna consciousness or in teaching Krishna consciousness. Totally about them.
So the point is there is always like this conflict between internal development and at the same time you can say external or institutional achievement.
Sometimes the devotees who will be achieving may be also internally very strong,
Internal development versus external achievements
but sometimes it is not seen like that, and as a sadhika, sometimes we are confused should I you know take a more of a Bhajanandi side or sadhaka side or or or so the point is how do I decide for it but is it does it revelation is it by revelation or is it by you know I regularly take siksha from someone some mentorship some some spiritual devotees or I um I mean I mean how do I do that finding the balance as you said or what's for me. So even at different stages of my life. So that's my precisely a question, like what kind of practice are step as first
of all the association of those devotees who are more advanced than us is always necessary. We will always be stuck in our condition because it's very difficult for ourselves to know how to move forward.
To move forward, we have to have visible example and association and also blessings of those devotees who are more advanced than us.
And of course, they can give us some personal counseling and personal advice: what to do in our particular situation and how to balance and how to go further.
But in general, of course, Śrīla Prabhupāda was not in favor of bhajananandī or whatever style.
And I remember Bhakti Tīrtha Mahārāja before his passing away, when he became terminally ill, and it was clear that he is leaving his body. He said that at one point I I will do Nirjan Bhajan.
And uh that's exactly what Śrīla Prabhupāda also said that uh in the last stage of life you have to do nirjana-bhajana which means that you are completely secluded in a secluded place, you're not associating with anyone.
You're just internally absorbed and trying to be absorbed internally.
And I remember that Bhakti Tīrtha Mahārāja he said still when in the previous stages he was very active meeting with many devotees, giving them counseling.
And he said, he declared, so now from now on I'm just in my last stage, I am in nirjana-bhajana.
But then, you know, I came and he met with me, and so many other people came. He met with them, and he was trying to give them encouragement and give them some help.
And the same with Śrīla Prabhupāda, he never was in the nirjana stage. And the same was with Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja. He never went into this nirjana-bhajana stage.
So Śrīla Prabhupāda's understanding and advice for us is that our practical service has to become our bhajan. But that's not easy. It's easy to say than to do in reality because,
uh, as I said, giving myself as an example, we may think that whatever I do it's my bhajan and it's my service. And it is service in one sense, it's a service to the institution. We have to be loyal to ISKCON.
This is all very important. But uh at the same time we become sometimes subtly, sometimes not so subtly attached to it. Uh we become attached to position, to some privileges which we have, this and that.
So to turn our um external engagement into our bhajan in real sense, uh uh we have to first of all do some introspection.
Uh how I'm doing it, am I doing it as really service or it's just some external thing which I like to do, which uh which I'm good at, uh uh and uh and really become very honest and sincere. I'm doing it as uh I'm doing it because uh this is my service.
So that's that's again the question of internal transformation or some introspection.
I'm looking within my heart and I'm asking myself, uh is it my service or am I doing it because I like it and because it brings me some benefit, gross or subtle. So and again and again and again it's a struggle.
Every day we have to remind ourselves, I'm doing it because this is this is the only thing which I can do. I cannot unfortunately I am not in the position to chant twenty-four hours a day.
I am not in the position to be like Haridas Thakur. I cannot do this. I will go crazy. So what I can do, I can do what I what I can do, but uh I do it in a different mood.
So to improve this mood or to make it to make the relationship with the activity which I do more internal on a deeper level. That's what we should also do.
But besides that, definitely we should have association with more advanced devotees
and we should be nourished by this association because sometimes l even little uh short association with advanced devotees can give you a lot.
He can just say to you one phrase or one word and this will be enough for one month to you for you to kind of understand and to practice what he said.
So these two things, to understand this, uh some internal work has to be there to transform our external services into more internal way, into more internal engagement and uh association with more senior devotees.
And who knows, maybe at one point we will become completely absorbed in bhajan. Or if not, Krishna will help us anyway.
And of course, our spiritual master is there, and if we are loyal to our spiritual master, his help will be there, there's no doubt about it.
Like Śrīla Prabhupāda said, he, somebody in a train, conductor in a train told him, you know, Swamiji, why are you writing all these magazines? Magazines people read and throw it in the garbage, write the books.
And Śrīla Prabhupāda heard these words and he said, this is my spiritual master talking to me. So he immediately recognized. He didn't discard this advice, some you know, tamoguni conductor saying some silly words to me.
He said, yeah no, this is directly coming from my spiritual master, because he was in sync with spiritual master.
And therefore he could recognize when somebody else would approach him and say something, he said, Yeah, this is my spiritual master telling me. I have to take his order on my head.
Comparing bhakti yoga with other paths
Thank you so much, Brother. What you initially described about jñāna-yoga and jñāna yogis' maintenance on I am Brahman, I am Brahman.
And secondly after that you describe what the Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura says is that, uh the spiritualization of Aham and Mama. Thank you so much.
You have extended all the things in detail and I have taken many lessons from today's class.
So my question is that uh uh it is very difficult uh to conceive oneself that in bhakti yoga it d it becomes very difficult that a childlike surrender.
Because in other yogas like Patañjali yoga also we see that one person is meditating on Brahman and he has uh abstained himself from the material world.
Brahman and he has, have he doesn't have any connection to the material world and he is not materially absorbed also so much.
But uh in my scenario uh I see myself that when in a preaching moment when we are of course we are engrossed with this commitment that we are doing for Krishna but while preaching and while doing services, we are myself materially absorbed so much in the karmi style.
So in that sense, of course bhakti-yoga is there, we are doing bhakti-yoga in one sense, external myself and on other yoga part we are seeing that there are conceivable results are coming. One is not materially so much absorbed while he's doing practicing yoga system.
But in bhakti-yoga I'm myself while I'm discriminating these two things. So how can I understand that the bhakti-yoga process is so easy that other something is no, I'm not digesting now this.
See the easy part of bhakti-yoga is that it's it's a powerful process, it's independently powerful. That's what exactly Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura is trying to impress upon us.
That bhakti-yoga doesn't require anything else, just chanting the holy name. The holy name has Vastu Shakti. Vastu Shakti is the inherent Shakti. And the Holy Name itself is powerful.
And that's why all this examples like Ajamila's example is there. He didn't know the power of the Holy Name. He chanted the holy name. And because Holy Name is independently powerful, it does not depend whether you know or not. It acts upon your consciousness anyway.
So it's easy in this way because the process of the changing 1018 text with Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam It's difficult exactly in the way which you described because not not exactly in the way which you described.
But along the lines which you described, the difficulties 1022 text with bhakti-yoga You still depend very much on yourself.
Like in path of Patañjali yoga, the idea is that I am doing something and therefore I will get result because I am doing this.
I am doing this practice, I am doing prāṇāyāma and and uh it's in one sense it's easy because today I uh I hold kumbhaka for one minute tomorrow for one minute and fifteen seconds in one week for two minutes and three months for three minutes and I feel progress.
You know uh every day uh my kumbhaka is becoming stronger and stronger and stronger. And uh because we're used to this, uh I am doing this. Uh it all depends on me, on my endeavors, and the result depends on me.
It's kind of easy because we're used to this approach in our material life also. I'm doing this and I'm getting the result according to my endeavors.
But bhakti yoga is difficult in this sense because from the very beginning it is said just surrender to Krishna and he will say and if everything and you surrender and you're waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting and nothing happens.
And especially people they hear this statement of Śrīla Prabhupāda, chant and be happy. And they started chanting and they're waiting, when I will become happy. And they chant, chant, when I become I am not becoming happy.
Śrīla Prabhupāda says chant and be happy. Śrīla Prabhupāda didn't say chant and you will become happy. Śrīla Prabhupāda said, chant and be happy.
It's it's different Like today I I saw one lady she was in uh she was in a jacket and a jacket was there smile and be happy so exactly the same formula smile and be happy chant and be happy.
It basically means chant and be happy. It's not that chant and then you will be happy. No. Just chant and be happy. Be happy about this.
So that's easy that's difficult to understand because it doesn't depend on kind of on myself, on my ego is not uh engaged in this in this sense.
Other processes are easier in this sense because you are kind of you feel I'm doing this.
So regarding your difficulties which you describe, if you are practicing your sadhana very properly, especially in the morning, and if your meditation on the holy name is proper, then it will protect you from being absorbed in matter for the rest of the day.
You will only be absorbed in matter, engrossed in this material consciousness while interacting with this if your sādhanā is not strong enough.
So it's basically a question of uh working more on the on on the strengths or on the power of your sādhanā, then you will not be you you will be immune uh even though you are among the, you know, in the material association, but at the same time you will not be in the material association.
Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura actually made a very interesting point and very important point too. He said that uh the um The association does not depend on the physical proximity.
Sometimes we say association means I am associating basically means I am I'm coming in contact with this in a physical sense.
Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura says no, no, this is not association. Association is not physical proximity. Association is the level of attachment which you have.
You may be associating very closely with some materialistic people, but at the same time if you're not attached to them, if you're not really dependent on them, if you not really you know putting yourself in the position I'm dependent on their mercy or whatever, then you're not associating with them.
You're giving your association to them. You're not taking their association and this way you're not really affected by and the mm close proximity.
So bhakti yoga is powerful because it is a powerful process because we have association of devotees and because we can be immune from this material association if our sādhanā is strong enough.
But again, we should not underestimate the power of Maya. Maya is very powerful. And all these ideas of material enjoyment and material happiness, they will always come to our mind.
We will see somebody who is driving his big car and we think, oh, he's so happy. He's not happy, he's miserable, but we will have this idea that he's happy.
The scientific process of devotional service
Thank you so much. Maharaj told uh Bhakti Yoga this uh in the beginning you told you should understand it scientifically and many of the lectures you mentioned that bhakti yoga is a science. So how do we understand that?
Can there be some logical explanation for this how bhakti yoga is a science of happiness on this.
Well, Śrīla Prabhupāda, when he would he was saying, I am not saying, I'm just repeating what Śrīla Prabhupāda always said, that this is a science of God.
And he contrasted bhakti-yoga from other religions, because other religions they emphasize faith. You have to believe. You have to believe.
Bhakti-yoga also says that you need faith in the beginning, ādau śraddhā. In the beginning you need little faith. Sometimes Śrīla Prabhupāda even says, in the beginning you need little faith.
He didn't sure that he didn't overemphasize the necessity of faith. Faith is necessary. But only in the beginning, just the faith is only the impetus for you to start practicing and to get the realization.
And what is science?
Science is basically the cause and effect, right? You know the cause, you try to find the cause, you know the effect, and you try to find the cause, and by knowing the cause and effect relationship, you can manipulate the situation or whatever, do whatever you like.
So Śrīla Prabhupāda explained that, you know, there is also cause and effect relationship in the spiritual science, and Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī he explains spiritual science exactly in these scientific terms.
He's explaining how we are coming from one stage to another, and how the transition takes place and what is the desired result and everything else.
The science, basically, you understand how the process works. And the process works in a very beautiful way. If you understand this, you understand the science. Basically, what is the science of bhakti?
The science of bhakti is that all our problems, because now our consciousness is absorbed into matter. We are bahirmukha. Bahirmukha means extrovert, literally. We are looking in the matter.
Our consciousness turned in this direction. So the process of bhakti-vedanta is scientific. It helps us to gradually, gradually turn our consciousness 180 degrees.
From being absorbed into the matter, into being absorbed in God. And it's a gradual process.
You cannot really only if Krishna, by Krishna's mercy, Krishna can take you little tiny soul and just do like this. But usually he doesn't do this. He only reciprocates with your desire to do this and then it means that you turn your consciousness little bit by chanting uh by initially getting interested in it.
This initial interest means Shraddha. Then you turn your consciousness little more. This little more stage means that you start hearing somebody whom you trust who will become your guru.
You really trust, you see his ideal and you want to become like him. That means that you turn your consciousness a little bit more. Then while taking as a but first you're just listening uh as a freelancer.
You just like to listen to this particular person, you like how he speaks, you like him, you like his way of speaking, explaining. But then you take the commitment, okay,
I'm listening to you and I trust you and my trust is so deep that I will do whatever you require. And that's Bhajana Kriya. You're taking responsibility upon your shoulders.
So in this way you turn more your consciousness is more, you are more committed now. Before that, you were doing whatever you liked and yes, you liked a little bit, Hare Kṛṣṇa, it's okay.
But then uh you're already more committed, you're doing regulated devotional service.
But then uh if you do it properly, then the obstacles which are internally they're gradually being overcome by the power of devotional service, and then you feel that you don't need anything else.
And the stage of Bhajana Kriya uh you're still very much materially absorbed and you still your your flow of thoughts going into this direction. But still you kind of pushing yourself because you uh took commitment upon yourself.
And on the level of Nishta, uh you don't look in this direction. But you don't look in this direction either. You look in this direction. Your consciousness is 90% 90 degrees turned.
It turned away from matter but it didn't turn towards the Lord. You're not interested in matter, but you're not interested in the Lord yet. That's why it's called Nishta. And it's intermediate stage.
And then if you turn it a little more, then the taste comes and you feel more attraction for the Lord. If you turn it little more then attachment comes, asakti comes.
And then if you turn it more then bhava comes and then if you turn it hundred and eighty degrees you're fully Krishna conscious. So that's the scientific process. How the turn of the consciousness gradually from one stage into another take place in the practice of your devotional service.
And what you should do, what is the propelling force or force which pushes you together? The chanting of the holy name.
Reading Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, hearing Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, associating with devotees, being in the holy dhāma. That's the scientific process of Krishna consciousness. Is it not scientific? It's an experiment.
Worldly interactions of advanced devotees
You try it and you'll see if it works or not. Yes. So in the beginning you told that you have to transition that uh before Nishta there is only 5% of structuralization of the ego. Yes. So suppose someone has attained prema.
Then uh logically it should be hundred percent of the structuralization.
So suppose he has attained that, so how will his physical uh uh touch with the world be will he feel good and etc like that and uh how can it be corroborated with the example You
don't have to be worried about this when when you come to this stage you will figure it out.
It basically means that Śrīla Prabhupāda explained, Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura is uh he is explaining that Madhyama-adhikāri, Kaniṣṭha-adhikāri is all the way till the stage of Nishta. Before reaching niṣṭhā, yoga-niṣṭhā. When you reach niṣṭhā, you become madhyama.
And then of course on the level of rāgānugā and vaidī-sādhana and the different classifications as far as Uttama is concerned.
But Śrīla Prabhupāda said that when uttamādhikāri somebody who has achieved very high status of spiritual realization wants to preach, he comes down to the level of Kanishta. Because he has to show by his personal example what it means to be a devotee in this world.
And he he has to be in the world. If you want to know what it means to be on a higher level and at the same time somehow rather exist in the material plane.
Read Śrī Caitanya-caritāmṛta, it explains there how Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu was struggling being in this material world at the same time experiencing this complete overwhelming bliss of love of God.
But more practical example, Śrīla Prabhupāda, he said he consciously comes down to the level of madhyama-adhikārī. It means that he behaves in a normal way, but internally he doesn't show
his internal ecstasy. Now every and then it just comes out, bursts out. But normally you reciprocate with the material world according to the material necessities.
But at the same time, you're completely convinced that uh this material world doesn't bring you happiness, doesn't make you happy. You're not enamored by it, you're not seduced by it. Did I answer your question?
To some extent. To some extent. So maybe the question urge that devotees want to ask, they can ask you personally if you are available and Yeah, sure, because it's late, yeah. Yeah, I also have to go. It's late.
Thank you very much. Śrīla Prabhupāda ki jaya!