Srimad-Bhagavatam. 3.26.22. Nature of consciousness. Lecture for Bhubaneshvar Youth Forum
Бхакти Вигьяна Госвами · 2021
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Appreciation for Jagannath Puri
Thank you very much for such kind words and for inviting me. I was very excited when Madhavananda Prabhu told me about this development and I immediately agreed to come to speak.
Actually I like uh Adisha, I like Jagannath Puri especially. That's one of my most favorite places. And so I have some selfish interest in mind while speaking with you.
Maybe sometime I will come there and see you in person. When all this madness will pass away. Regarding topic of my discussion, yes, I was not extremely excited
about the first topic which was given to me, although it's understandable that it's interesting for you to hear how it was like.
But I've been talking about this so many times, and I'm kind of tired to talk about this again. So I rather prefer to speak something from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
But because the request was there, I will speak a few words about my background and how I joined, and why specifically I joined because it will be connected with the topic which I will try to present.
I will speak from the third canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam from the teachings of Kapila Dev, where he defines the fundamental principles of the material nature.
I will specifically talk about the nature of our consciousness or chitta, which Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu defines in the first verse of Śikṣāṣṭaka, not defines but says that the main target of the holy name is to purify our
citta, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam. So I will specifically say what does it mean and what are the ramifications? Why do we have to purify our consciousness? What are the reasons to purify our consciousness?
So I'll talk about this, but before I'll speak a few words about my specific background
but let me first uh uh chant the verse uh from the twenty sixth chapter of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and uh uh and then I'll speak on this topic.
Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya, Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Nārāyaṇaṁ namaskṛtya naraṁ caiva narottamaṁ deviṁ sarasvatīṁ vyāsaṁ tato jayam udīrayet.
Naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā bhagavaty uttama-śloke bhaktir bhavati naiṣṭhikī.
yan-pravrajantam anupetam apeta-kṛtyaṁ dvaipāyano viraha-kātara ājuhāva putreti tan-mayatayā taravo 'bhinedus taṁ sarva-bhūta-hṛdayam munim nato 'smi.
Introduction to verse on chitta
anopetam petakritiem, Dwaipaya no virahakatara Juhav putre Tan Mayatayo, Travinedus, Tam Sarva Buta Hridayam unimanatos So the verse which I have chosen for our discussion tonight is the 22nd verse from the 26th chapter.
And in this particular verse, Lord Kapiladev gives the definition of Paribasha to the element of Chitta.
He gives a specific lakshanas of chitta by which we can recognize what is chitta, what is our consciousness, what is material consciousness.
Chitta is a material consciousness, but still it's a very important element and we have to really clearly understand how it functions, what it does, uh why do we have to purify and what will happen
when we will purify the citta.
Why Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu so boldly says that cetoh-darpana mārjanam, bhava-mahādāvagni-nirvāpaṇaṁ, śreyaḥ-kairava-candrikā-vitaranaṁ, all these effects are stemming from this cetoh-darpana mārjanam.
So we will discuss all this important topic. As Madhavananda Prabhu said that I like to speak—just let me answer. Uh okay. Just one second. Charge, I'm giving class at the moment. I will be late for your class.
I'm really sorry. I'm on Zoom now. Okay? Kṣamyatām, kṣamyatām. Okay. So Madhavananda Prabhu said that I like to speak about the holy name. It's purely for my own self-purification and my own improvement.
So I, by speaking about this, I remind myself how important it is to concentrate on the holy name and how important it is to chant purely and what does it mean to chant purely, so
the verse number 22: svācchanyam avikāritvaṁ śāntatvam iti cetasāṁ vṛttibhir lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ yathāpāṁ prakṛtiḥ param.
After manifestation of the Mahatattva, these features appear simultaneously as water in its natural state before coming in contact with earth is clear, sweet, and unruffled.
So the characteristic traits of pure consciousness are complete serenity, clarity, and freedom from distraction.
Purport by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada: pure status of consciousness or Krishna consciousness exists in the beginning. Just after creation, consciousness is not polluted.
The more one becomes materially contaminated, however, the more consciousness becomes obscured. In pure consciousness, one can perceive a slight reflection of the supreme personality of Godhead.
As in clear, unagitated water free from impurities, one can see everything very clearly. So, in pure consciousness or Krishna consciousness, one can see things as they are.
One can see the reflection of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and one can see his own existence as well. This state of consciousness is very pleasing, transparent and sober. In the beginning, consciousness is pure.
So we can see how Prabhupada is connecting this particular verse with a very important and relevant topic for us. What is our conditioned consciousness and why do we have to purify it and why it is so important?
So let me chant Mangalacharana first and then I'll speak on the topic.
Namah om Vishnu-padaya Krishna-presthaya bhu-tale, Srimate Bhaktivedanta Svami iti namine. Namaste sarasvati deve gaura-vani-pracharine, nirvisesa-sunyavadi-pascatya-desa-tarine. Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare, Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare, Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare.
Ananda-lila-maya-vigrahaya, hemabha-divya-cchavi-sundaraya, tasmai maha-prema-rasapradaya, caitanya-candraya namo namaste. Mookam karoti vacalam pangum langhayate girim yat-kripa tam aham vande sri-gurum dina-taranam. Paramanandam madhavam sri caitanya-isvaram.
Shravanat Vagadim, Pranana Mauva Gavate Purushatubi. Swasastu Vishwasi Kalah, Prasida tam Dyantu Bhutani, Shivam Mithudi Yamanash
Speaker journey to Krishna consciousness
Chabadram Baja T Again, Hare Krishna, and welcome to this little talk about the philosophy and practice of Krishna consciousness.
So, as I promised, I will start a little bit from my own background and why did I join the Hare Krishna movement? Actually, not in my wildest dream, I thought about joining some sort of religious organization.
I was quite an atheistic person and not without a reason.
My parents were atheists, my grandparents were atheist, my grandgrandmother, she believed in God, but when I was a small child, I was preaching to her that there is no God.
I was very much programmed in this way, and I thought my grand-grandmother, she's just utterly stupid and she doesn't understand the reality of things.
And yeah, I graduated from Moscow State University and then I started doing my postgraduation studies, doing a PhD degree in molecular biology in particular, in the Institute of Molecular Biology.
When at one point, one friend of mine gave me Bhagavad-gītā. And he said, why don't you read it?
It was not Srila Prabhupada's Bhagavad Gita, it was Prabhupada Bhagavad-gītā translated by some members of Theosophical Society, just one
simple verses without even much explanation, and I read this little book, it was a small, tiny book. I read this book and I was completely, totally shocked. This book impressed me so much.
And the immediate thought which appeared in my mind is that if it's true, I should not live the life which I live now.
It was an amazing conclusion, but it was very clear because I kind of understood that there is a higher truth behind this book. Even though I can clearly understand now that I didn't understand anything from this book.
You know it was translated in a very flowery language, in a very esoteric language with a lot of strange things there.
So I didn't really understand what the book is, but I one thing I could clearly understand that there is some truth behind this.
It's not just some words in a paper, it's not just some imagination, some creation of some poet or whatever. There is some higher truth behind this.
And not only higher truth, but the truth which by its by the fact of its existence, it's very compulsory that it it more or less forces me to change my way of life. We all know it's difficult to change our way of life.
We're all programmed, we're all conditioned by our background, by our surrounding, by our relatives. They all want us to behave in a certain way.
But just by reading this book without understanding anything about this book, this thought appeared in my mind, I should change something perhaps in my life.
And what struck me, what was the most striking feature of this book. What was the first impression?
Is that this book is presenting a worldview which is even though it's totally theistic, it is spiritual and it's speaking about God. Nevertheless, it's very very, rational.
We are used to think that if it is religion, it has to be something totally irrational. And the more irrational it is, the more religious it is. So that's the that's the usual impression.
You know, and you just have to blindly believe in it and uh basically, you know, the impression which most of the people, especially in the West, have about religion, is that you know it's something for totally irrational people.
uh and uh uh you know you you just have to blindly believe in it uh and uh you know it's just uh because you are irrational yourself this is your shelter.
You you try to find shelter of something similar to you, and only totally irrational people can be religious.
So, my first encounter with Bhagavad-gītā, or Vedic spirituality, let's put it more properly, with the Vedic cultural Vedic approach to spirituality, changed completely, totally, this misconception which I had.
I realized just again by reading, by just very slight encounter with this book, I realized that spirituality does not have to be irrational. And I don't have to become irrational by practicing spirituality.
I still I still can retain my rationality and at the same time practice some spiritual life. Which was a great discovery for me.
You know, I don't have to believe in some superstitions, I don't have to become stupid and you know, I don't have to become a fanatic, I don't have to become dogmatic.
I can become at I can remain normal human being, but at the same time practice some sort of religion or spirituality. That was that was a great discovery for me.
And actually that was a first step towards this because as I said in the beginning,
I why I never thought about joining any religious organization because I thought it would change my personality in certain way which I didn't want to have.
So uh uh and that's why I started practicing, I started chanting at that time. My friend who gave me Bhagavad Gita said, why don't you chant?
You know, and because uh I had this idea that I have to change something in my life, and I didn't know what I have to change. So this suggestion from my friend was very welcome.
I realized that yeah, this is something which I can change in my life. Now I can chant something.
And even though you know while I st when I started chanting, sometimes I looked from the objective point at myself and I was asking myself, what are you doing? You are a scientist. What is going on with you?
Nevertheless, this experience of chanting gave me something very special. I also could realize that it's not just parrot As Śrīla Prabhupāda used to say. There is again something much higher behind this.
And that was also very intriguing to me. I mean, as because I am scientist, I actually I was born under the Mrigashira Nakshatra.
And those people, Prabhupada also was born under Mrigashira Nakshatra. That's his nakshatra of his birth. Those people who are born in Mrigashira Nakshatra or Margashira, Mrigashira, They are very inquisitive.
They always want to know something new. They are really, you know, they want to investigate things.
So for me, the journey for Krishna consciousness started from this desire to investigate something new, to explore different ways of life, and to explore different possibilities in life and different experiences which I may have.
And I'm still exploring this. Actually, my friend, the friend of mine told me that you know if you will chant this Hare Krishna mantra, you will see some aura around people.
And I was very interested, I thought, really far out, I will see some aura. I don't see any aura. You know, and I started chanting with this idea in mind. I have to confess that 40 years later I still don't see any aura.
But nevertheless, the process is remaining very interesting because every day something new is happening and I you know in this journey I made some very important discoveries which are very treasurable for myself.
I treasure them a lot. Very important discoveries, how my mind works, you know what I need really, and so many other things.
KGB opposition in Soviet Russia
Some of them I will share with you tonight. But you know the communistic government was not really happy that some people uh joined Krishna consciousness movement and they started a huge campaign.
But what is the most amazing for me is that even though at that time I was very remotely connected with Krishna consciousness movement when the Secret Police, the KGB, the intelligence service, not intelligence service, but secret police, came to my place of work and threatened me.
What is the most amazing for me still to this date is that I didn't I was not tempted or seduced or I didn't change my conviction.
Moreover, even though they threatened me, they told me we will put you in prison, we will stop your career, you will be suffering, you will be nobody, you know, you will not get any education, you will never get your degree.
So despite of all these threats, You know, little did they know that by saying this they only increased my conviction that there must be something very important in this Krishna consciousness movement.
And I will explain why. You know, at that time, devotees in Russia it was a very strange scene.
You know, there were only a few dozens of devotees, they were from very variegated backgrounds, they were not really, you know, anyone whom you would consider as a threat.
And at this time, you know, the whole state machinery, the whole state of persecution machinery of the state started persecuting this handful of devotees, including
my humble self, who didn't even I wasn't even a devotee, I was just, you know, chanting a little bit and still was not really decided.
But the reaction of the state really proved to me that there's something behind this Krishna consciousness movement. There must be something. They should know better.
I may not understand the influence of this movement, but the secret police must know better because this is their job.
So, so since that time I consider Secret Police of Russia one of my vartma-pradarsaka gurus. They really. Convinced me that I must follow this path. So that's my little involvement.
Then little story how I became involved, and how just from the from the sense of contrariness uh I became a devotee. I mean this is my nature and I guess I am in Rādhārāṇī's camp.
She's also contrary to recording in progress. But anyway, so I became a devotee just from the sense of contrariness. Uh the state didn't want me to become a devotee.
I thought okay, that's a good that's a good reason for me to become a devote to become a devotee.
Anyway, but as I already said to you, despite my involvement with Krishna consciousness movement, I try to retain my rationality and scientific approach towards things.
And That probably I mean that gives a little flavor to my presentations when I start speaking some scientific sort of language or explains certain things from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
From the scientific point of view, it has its attraction for certain people and it definitely has an attraction to myself.
Material evolution and Mahat-tattva
And of course, that's the reason why this particular chapter of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and the whole presentation of Lord Kapiladev is very important for me.
Maybe at some other point I'll have a chance to speak about the 29th chapter of the third canto, which explains devotional service and the modes of nature.
It's a very very interesting chapter which I studied in depth and I may share with you something about this.
But for today I wanted to speak about this nature of consciousness and the three main characteristics of the nature of consciousness and what happens, what will happen when we will return to this original state of consciousness.
Śrīla Prabhupāda is very emphatic. He says the original state of our consciousness, material consciousness, chitta is pure, and by as much as the drop of the water before it touches the ground is pure.
The rain water when it falls from the sky is pure in a similar way originally when we just come in contact with the m— I mean, of course, we may, there are different theories.
I'm not going to touch this, but in any case, we have to understand that there is an original state of our consciousness, original in a sense that it's by nature like this.
And Kapiladev explains that in macrocosm there is Mahatattva, and Mahatattva is the first material element which evolves from prakṛti. Prakṛti is an unmanifest state of material energy.
But when the prakṛti is agitated by the energy of kāla, which is actually the glance of the Lord. The glance of the Lord by touching the unmanifest state of material nature, agitates this material nature and it injects
jīvas, the jīva souls, conditioned souls into the material nature with their karma, and these jīvas they throw this balanced state of material nature into imbalanced state.
And the evolution starts, and the first element which is highly
sattvic and very transparent is called mahat-tattva. This mahat-tattva is the original material. And on our body, within our body, within our consciousness, it is present as citta. And as it is said in the previous verse, it is bhagavat-padaṁ. As Prabhupāda beautifully explains this, it's the space or padam, the stage where we can meet with the Supreme Lord or worship the Supreme Lord. Actually, that's very interesting because when your consciousness becomes pure, when your cheetah becomes pure, then the spirituality or the relationship with the Lord becomes very natural.
You don't have any doubts whether God exists or not. All the doubts which we may have at present state is due to the impurities, due to the influence of Tamagun and Rajagun within our consciousness.
But when the consciousness becomes pure, as it is said here, it's when the consciousness becomes pure, it re-establishes the first quality of the consciousness.
Clarity and transparency of pure consciousness
The three qualities of cheetah which is present within ourself but which fully manifest only when uh the cheetah becomes very pure due to the chanting of the holy name. The first quality is Svachatvam.
And Svachatvam, you all know what it is what it means. You know, svachabharat. You know, we all follow this modhis program, clean Bharat. Swachatvam means cleanliness.
But Sridhar Swami and Vishwana Chakravati Thakur and Srila Prabhupada, they gloss this particular quality. Swachatvam means basically transparency.
The cheetah, in its original state, it's transparent and Sridhaswami and Viswana Chakravardi Thakur they glose this Svachatvama transparency as Bhagavat Bimba Grahitvam.
Or as Prabhupada says, that the pure Chita can have little reflection of Bhagavan, of the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
Bhagavat bimba grahitvam means that when the chitta becomes so pure, we we see the reflection of the Supreme Personality of Godhead within our Chitta and we worship him.
And also, Prabhupada also explains very important things when our cheetah becomes pure.
We see not only the reflection of God within our consciousness, we see the reflection of ourselves within our consciousness, which we unfortunately don't see at this moment because our consciousness is covered by this lower modes of material nature or by this aspect of Maya which is called Avaranatmika Shakti. This Avaranatmika Shakti puts the Avarana, the covering over our consciousness, and we don't see ourselves.
As it is said in Yoga Sutra of Patanjali, Chitavriti Niroda, Yoga's Chitavriti Niroda, and then uh Tadadrashtuh, Svarupa Vastanaha.
Then when your cheetah becomes uh clear, when there is no disturbance in the chitta, uh and we will explain what disturbance in the cheetah means next.
But then tada tada Drashtuk Swarupa Vastana tada. At that time, Drashtuch, the seer, the soul, the source of consciousness, the seed of consciousness within ourselves, it becomes established in its Svarupa and he sees his own Swarupa.
I was told a beautiful story about Śrīla Gour Govinda Mahārāja. I really like this beautiful story, little story. One a devotee asked him, Guru Mahārāja, please tell me what is our svarūpa?
Because it's a big question and controversial question in our sampradāya. Do we have our svarūpa already, or the svarūpa has to be given to us by a guru. And you know there are different opinions.
But the answer of Śrīla Gour Govinda Mahārāja was amazing and very strong. He said, everything is already within you. And he quoted simple verse from the second chapter of Bhagavad-gītā to prove this.
Nāsato vidyate bhāvo nābhāvo vidyate satah. He said something which has existed in never it never can disappear, you know. So he said it's already within you. And basically that's what Śrīla Prabhupāda also says here.
When your consciousness becomes clear, Bhagavad-ādarśa-grāhitvam, you see the reflection of the Lord within the mirror of your heart, and you see your own reflection.
Tadā draṣṭuḥ svarūpe 'vasthānam, according to the Yoga-sūtra of Patañjali, sūtra of Patañjali, Yoga-sūtra, you will be established in your own svarūpa, and you will see the reflection of svarūpa in this pure consciousness.
So that's the first quality of citta: svācchattva: the reflective ability. And therefore, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he compares our citta with darpaṇa. He compares it with the mirror.
The mirror has the reflective ability, but at this moment, the mirror of our consciousness, the mirror of our heart is polluted, and therefore we don't have clear perception of the world even. We don't see the world clearly.
Prabhupāda says in this purport, then when our consciousness becomes clear, uh clean and transparent, not only will we see the Supreme Lord, we will very clearly see the world around us as it is.
Whereas now we have very perverted perception of the world. In other words, if you are a scientist and if you want to know the things as they are,
you have to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare, Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma, Rāma, Hare Hare. As much as you know, I have these glasses, you know, you have to clean these glasses every now and then, otherwise you see some, you know, only the dirt which is on the glasses. And in the same way, the people who study the world around them but they don't have clean consciousness, they only see the dirt which is around them in the matter.
And then they say, Yeah, this is what this is my discovery. The world is like this. It's dirty. No, dear sir, the world is not dirty. Your consciousness is dirty.
Freedom from mental transformation and distraction
So that's the first quality. The second quality is even more interesting.
It is said here that svācchatvaṁ śāntaṁ, no, sorry, svācchatvam it is uh svācchatvam avikāritvam. Avikāritvam means there is no transformation or there is no vikāra in our consciousness when it's clear.
You know, we can see very clearly that there is some vikāra within our consciousness when we interact with this material nature, this vikāra means the change of the state of consciousness.
You know, right now you are awake. But if I talk too much, some of you will fall asleep. It's the same consciousness, but it will be transformed. You will see some dreams.
You know, and sometimes we know when we just fall asleep.
You know, there are different images come to our consciousness and it's a very strange changed state of consciousness, little different consciousness, not exactly the same which we have when we are awake.
Or when we take some drugs. Hopefully you never took them. I I I didn't take either, but some people took. And it's a changed state of consciousness.
And also when we become very distracted, like right now you're sitting and you're listening and you're more or less concentrated on this.
But we all know as soon as we open our mobile phone and start browsing through the internet, immediately the consciousness becomes distracted. We cannot really concentrate it on one subject matter.
There is this attention deficit syndrome, develops. So, this all different transformations within our consciousness. Originally, our consciousness is very calm, it's very concentrated.
Actually, by nature, we are concentrated. The distraction which is there is artificial, it's imposition upon our consciousness. Our original consciousness is concentrated.
When we chant the holy name and when our consciousness becomes distracted when we go somewhere here or somewhere there, it means that there is some impurity within our heart.
When the consciousness becomes clean, then naturally you will be very easily you will concentrate on some subject matter according to your wish. What to speak about concentrating on the holy name.
Therefore, it is said in the third verse of Śikṣāṣṭaka, tṛṇād api su-nīcena taror iva sahiṣṇunā amāninā mānadena. You You will always be concentrated on the holy name when your consciousness becomes clean. will always be concentrated on the holy name when your consciousness becomes clean.
This third state, third verse of Śikṣāṣṭaka describes this clean consciousness. When citta or cetanā become clean, then we naturally become humble, we very are tolerant and we are very concentrated.
So when we chant and we feel that the mind is has some vikṣepa or distraction, it means some impurities there. So what shall we do? We should continue chanting.
Because Caitanya Mahāprabhu promises to us that all these impurities will be purified, will be cleansed away from our consciousness by this process of chanting.
So the second quality, avikāritvam, is glossed by Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura and also Śrīdhara Svāmī as laya vikṣepa-rahitvam. It means the absence of laya and vikṣepa.
Laya is this changed state of consciousness when tamas or tamo-guṇa is very heavily influencing our consciousness. When we go to sleep, when we are completely, you know, we are I don't know what's going on.
Just leave me alone. This is laya. Laya means the destruction of consciousness. Literally, laya means destruction means destruction. When the consciousness is destroyed, no consciousness.
When we are deep in sleep, you know, there is no consciousness. But how is it possible that we don't have consciousness? It's because our citta, we're always conscious. Because consciousness is the nature of the soul.
But when the citta is covered during the deep sleep or during some sleep state, is covered by tamo-guṇa, then it seems to us subjectively that we are unconscious.
Or sometimes we may ask what happens when somebody faints or when somebody takes a huge dose of drug, or when somebody is under anaesthesia. What happens with the soul? Why we don't feel anything?
This is exactly the reason. Different drugs they impose a very strong influence of tamagun upon our consciousness and because of this tamagun we become unconscious for some time, which is necessary when we do some surgery or whatever.
But that's the mechanism behind this. But that's vicara. When this vicara is not there, then one is always in this state of complete serene consciousness or very clean or clear consciousness.
You know, there was a very interesting episode which Śrīla Rānāth Mahārāj explains in his book of Journey Home. He speaks about quite famous and personalist, Nimkaroli Baba.
He was living there in Vrindavan, and according to him, he was a partial manifestation of Hanumān. But otherwise, he was quite an advanced personalist. Sometimes he was present simultaneously in different places.
So he had his disciple Ramdas, Western disciple, who made him very famous in the West. This Ramdas is quite a famous figure in the esoteric scene in America.
And he started his journey to spirituality from the experiments with drugs. Specifically with LSD.
And you know when you take LSD, you have all kinds of strange hallucinations and, uh, you feel like your consciousness expands, and you sometimes encounter God there or whatever, some all kinds of strange stuff.
Śrīla Prabhupāda always had to preach to his hippie disciples that LSD will not bring you closer to God. Because that was the very common misconception among those generations of hippie or spiritual seekers in America.
that by LSD you can get some spiritual experience. But very interesting, this episode which I want to tell you is a very interesting illustration to this verse.
Because when Ramdas came to this Neem Karoli Baba, he could understand that he has a higher consciousness.
And he wanted to explore or to see what effect LSD will have upon him, what he will do, or what will happen with him if he takes LSD. And he gave him a huge dose of LSD and he said, Guru Maharaj, please take it.
You know, this is hippie mentality. You know. But anyway, uh, he took it. Very nonchalantly, very peacefully he took it. And what happened? Nothing happened. You know, his consciousness was not transformed.
And that's a very important illustration or proof to this verse of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam because in this verse of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam Kapiladeva says that when the consciousness becomes clear, it's avikāritvam, nirvikāra.
You take drugs, nirvikāra. You take a big dose of you know anesthetic and nothing happens to you. You're not really stoned, so to speak. This is a hippie jargon, stoned. When you take some drug, you become like a stone.
It basically means that tamo-guṇa becomes very prominent in your consciousness.
But here it is said that despite of all these external influences, if you reach this state of clear consciousness, you remain non-affected by this. No change in your consciousness, avai-śālitvam.
And it means that you constantly concentrate it on the holy name. Kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ. Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna, Krishna Hare Hare, Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma, Rāma Hare Hare.
You constantly hear the sound of the Holy Name and you understand by your clear consciousness that the sound of the Holy Name is no different from God Himself.
Because you see how his image, his robe is reflected from this Nam in your consciousness.
Peacefulness and freedom from negative emotions
That's the second quality of cheetah, of clean cheetah. And the third quality is even more interesting.
Why it is even more interesting, what could be more interesting than to have reflection of God within our consciousness?
What could be more interesting than to become completely transcendental towards all this uh you know influences external influences uh yeah there is something which is more interesting.
Well, maybe not more interesting, but maybe even more relevant to us. And this is also mentioned by Śrīla Prabhupāda in his purport to this verse.
The third quality is śāntatvam, and it means that when your consciousness becomes clean, clean, and clear, you become completely peaceful and happy. Krishna says in Bhagavad-gītā, aśāntasya kutaḥ sukham.
How you can become happy without peace, without shanti.
And Prabhupāda explains this in the purport and Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura, he glosses this śāntatvam. He says, rāgādi-rahityam means that there is no negative emotions. You don't experience negative emotions starting with raga.
Raga means attachment. Raga means this passion. And when your consciousness becomes very peaceful, then you don't have any negative emotions. And it means that you're happy, you're totally happy.
Why did I say that it's more relevant? Because we all want to become happy.
And how we become happy, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjānaṁ bhava-mahādāvāgni-nirvāpaṇam. When our consciousness becomes clean through the chanting of the holy name,
then all this davagni, this very fierce fire of material sufferings, of bhava, all these negative emotions which we have, grief, anger, attachment, envy, you know all this you know desperation or despondency or dejection, all these negative emotions which we all have, fear, you know, they all disappear from our consciousness.
Shantatvam. Śrīla Prabhupāda says when the when the drop of water becomes very calm, you know, it's naturally transparent and there is no there is no this you know, all these waves in the consciousness.
Uh you become happy because uh the peaceful state is the happy state, and not only happy, because happy sometimes we become, even in this world, we sometimes feel
some elation, but we become completely immovably happy or how you say this uh completely uh un you know nothing will unshakingly happy Nothing will shook you or will disturb you or will throw you out of cons of happiness. You will remain happy in all circumstances.
That's the sign of clean, clear consciousness. If your consciousness is clean and clear, you remain happy under any circumstances.
There is a beautiful story about Śrīla Prabhupāda in this regard. You know, I like to tell this story. You know, when there was a very difficult situation in Iskon and there was there was a court case in America.
And the programmers they wanted to close down completely the Krishna consciousness movement in America.
uh and uh there were some fines to towards devotees and you know so many problems and on the top of it in India there were so many problems in Bombay there were problems uh with this Mr. Nair in Juhu, and you know, all these problems they were building up, the pressure was building up, building up, building up, and Prabhupada was receiving bad news every day.
And we all know we get little bad news and our consciousness becomes completely, you know, we become morose for some time, we we become disturbed.
So this whole heavy pressure was coming upon Śrīla Prabhupāda. And ultimately, some telegram came. I don't remember from where from Australia or from some other port part of the world
is this telegram contained the very bad news. Very bad news. Something really bad happened. And Śrīla Prabhupāda opened this telegram and he read this telegram.
And nothing changed in his uh He remained very sober and very grave as he usually was. But then he went to his room and his secretary, he became really
curious what's going on, what he will do. And he looked in the in the keyhole. What Śrīla Prabhupāda will be doing. And Prabhupāda saw that Prabhupāda laid down on the floor and started laughing.
He didn't express his laughter in front of everyone, but when he was alone in his room he just started laughing and he was laughing and laughing and laughing.
And his secretary was looking at him and he couldn't figure out what's going on. But that's exactly what's going on.
As it is said here by Kapiladeva, that first quality is svacchatvam, another quality is avikāritvam, and the third quality is śāntatvam. And śāntatvam means rāgādi-rahitvam. There is no negative emotions.
No experience of negative emotions ever. Never.
So and uh but let me explain a little more if I have time, Madhavananda Prabhu or Tukaram Prabhu, please or somebody tell me if I have some time more or shall I finish now because I wanted to say few few other important things but I don't have to.
Yes. Yes. Marathi helped time please.
Connection between happiness and expanded consciousness
Okay. Okay Okay. So um I wanted to uh ask you a question and give an answer to the question which I will ask you. But please think about it first before I start speaking or answering this question.
What does it mean happiness? Why sometimes we are happy, and sometimes we are unhappy. What does it mean in terms of consciousness? How should we interpret this in terms of consciousness?
And why some people are constantly unhappy, and some people are generally more happy. What quality of consciousness would determine the state of our well-being, of our you know emotional uh condition.
So that's that's the question uh which uh I want you to think uh for a moment. Because ultimately we are talking about this pure state of consciousness. Why pure state of consciousness is a happy consciousness.
Why Śrīla Prabhupāda was so emphatic about this? Why he always said chant and be happy, and that the happiness is a natural consequence of chanting.
Why why are we so bold to say that when your consciousness is clean, it also means that it will become happy. So let me explain it a little bit. First of all, we should understand very clearly what unhappiness means.
Unhappiness means contracted consciousness. When the consciousness is really kind of jammed or contracted. Why this you know how our consciousness becomes contracted by the influence of false ego.
It is explained again by Kapiladeva in this third canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in the same basically same chapter, it is said that the false ego limits our consciousness.
Our consciousness is by nature is very expensive, and it is said when our consciousness becomes clean, we connect with mahat-tattva. Why yogis can have all these powers?
Because they connect with the with the source of consciousness, mahat-tattva. And they get all kinds of information from there.
It's like we have our little individual computer and in our computer we have some certain information stored on the hard disk.
But when our individual computer is connected with the you know with internet with the source of information, then the information we can get unlimited amount of information.
The information which is there on our hard disk is limited.
But when we connect with the higher co higher consciousness or higher memory or whatever, then the information becomes unlimited and we can really get access to different sorts of information.
In the same way, yogi who cleanses his consciousness, he connects with this Mahatattva.
And by connecting with Mahatattva, he gets all kinds of information and he can, you know, he can know what is in within your consciousness because he does not have limiting influence of false ego.
False ego is by nature tamasic. Kapiladeva explains this very clearly that this sāttvika citta, the next transformation of the sāttvika citta, is tāmasika false ego, ahaṅkāra.
And when ahaṅkāra limits us, uh it basically uh kind of contracts the citta uh by the pressure of tamo-guṇa.
And when we are in this uh egoistic consciousness, our consciousness even though it's expansive by nature, it's really huge, it's connected with this Mahatattva. It can include the Supreme Personality of Godhead within within it.
It is said in Upaniṣads that Anantiya kalpata, that our individual consciousness can become unlimited.
Really, because the consciousness has this nature of expanding, so but when it comes in contact with false ego under the influence of false ego, it becomes very limited and contracted by the limits of false ego.
Depending on the nature of false ego, it becomes less limited or more limited. So please now imagine the glass of water. And then also imagine the huge ocean.
And you throw a little sand of uh little grain of sand or little pebble into this glass of water. What will happen with this glass of water? There will be a lot of waves.
And these waves will be coming to the limits of this and coming back and creating all kinds of disturbances.
But when you throw the same pebble into or you know grain of sand into the ocean, what happened with the ocean? Not much. The ocean remains the ocean. You know, there is not much disturbance. Why? Because it's so expansive.
Even if there is some disturbance, it's just it doesn't bounce back.
You know, so what happened when our consciousness is limited by our false ego, little disturbance is there, and this little disturbance creates huge waves within our consciousness.
Because the consciousness is so contracted, and these waves within our consciousness which forces us to lose composure and calmness and peacefulness is called negative emotions.
So all negative emotions are only there because of false ego. When we don't have tamasi false ego, when our consciousness is clean, there's no disturbances.
And uh we only feel this calm and peaceful uh state of our consciousness, which means happy consciousness. So uh the question which I asked: what is the difference between happy consciousness and unhappy consciousness.
Happy consciousness is expanded consciousness.
And when we temporarily feel happy or through some artificial means you know the consciousness becomes expanded. You know, when people take LSD, then there is certain expansion of consciousness which they experience.
Of course, when the influence of drug disappears, then the consciousness becomes even less contracted and therefore you get depression. But that's the idea, please catch this very important concept.
The happiness means expanded consciousness. And the more our consciousness expanded, the happy we are. And what is the limiting adjunct of our consciousness is this false ego. I am this body.
I am Indian, I am Russian, I am this, I am that, or I am an animal, I am this, I am that. This is all tamas. And until we remain in this tamasi state of consciousness or egoistic consciousness, selfish consciousness.
I am this. I am a woman. And therefore I have to be, you know, I have to fight with all the men. You know, you will never become happy. You know, like Prabhupāda, he he made this correction to Bhakti Tīrtha Mahārāja.
Bhakti Tīrtha Mahārāja said, you know, Prabhupāda, you know, I came to this Krishna consciousness movement. I saw that there is no chauvinism here. That there is no racism here.
And Prabhupāda looked at him and said, Yes, it's there, but you're not different. You're not much different because you you feel it, you notice it. Because it means that you already also have the same bodily consciousness.
And bodily consciousness means unhappy consciousness. Unless and until we retain consciousness of our body within the limits or parameters of our false ego, we will remain unhappy.
Five stages of expanding consciousness
So that's a very important concept, and you know, Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, he explains five stages of expansion of consciousness.
He says that āchādita cetana and then uh uh how it's called uh mu no, before mukulita cetana, chatana, how it's called, I forget, I'm sorry.
Ah, āchādita uh, saṅkucita cet. Saṅkucita, yes, saṅkucita. Yes, saṅkucita cetana. Āchādita cetana, when uh when the consciousness is in the trees, you don't really know whether they're conscious or not.
You know, in the West, people think that there is no consciousness in the trees because it's āchādita. It's completely contracted. Saṅkucita means there is some little manifestation of consciousness.
And that's what you can see in the animals and in birds. You can see that there is some consciousness, but it's very limited consciousness.
And then there is mukulita cetana cetana and vikasita cetana and pūrṇa-vikasita cetana. Mukulita cetana budding consciousness when consciousness becomes a little more expanded in a human form of life.
But still, because it's limited, it's still in a budding stage, it's not really expanded, then you don't really see the reality as it is. You can limitedly see the cause and effect.
You know, the more expensive your consciousness becomes, the more clearly you see the cause and effect relationship in this world, and ultimately you will be able to see the cause of all causes.
Why people reject the existence of God only because their consciousness is so contracted, is so limited. So they cannot really see the cause beyond the causes.
They only see the immediate causes and try to study immediate causes. This mukulita cetasa means scientists. It's a very low state of consciousness. Really low. I'm speaking about myself. I am speaking on my experience.
You know, it's a very limited approach to reality. It's mukulita cetasa.
And when the reality becomes more you know more expanding and becomes more flourishing, when the lotus of our consciousness starts expanding, then we will clearly understand yes, there is God.
And this reflection of the image of God will take place within our consciousness. And at the same time we become happy. Because this expansion of consciousness will take place.
And when it's Purnavikasita, then which is according to Bhaktivinoda, is the stage when one experiences bava or emotions towards the Lord, that's the happiest state of consciousness.
So the more contracted the consciousness is, the more unhappy you become. And that all depends on the level of our selfishness,
Chanting Hare Krishna beyond false ego
of our complete concentration on false identity, the identity of uh this uh material body. And there is one more little thing which I wanted also to uh tell in this connection, uh which could be relevant, is that
you know when we chant, very important thing which will be the last thing which I tell now, when we chant uh we sometimes feel happiness, sometimes we feel that our consciousness is expanding, sometimes we feel very generous, very uh liberal, you know, and sometimes we don't feel this.
Why? Because we can chant within our false ego, within our ahaṅkāra, or we can chant without ahaṅkāra.
You know when Chaitanya Mahaprabhu says, Na ahaṁ vipro na ca nara-patir nāpi vaiśyo na śūdro, na ahaṁ vārṇī na ca gṛhasto vā vanastho yatir vā. He says he explains the consciousness in which we should chant.
If we chant within the parameters of our ego, that's called nāmāparādha. When we chant and we always concerned, this is I am who I am, I'm this and I'm that, I'm senior devotee. And everyone should respect me.
You know, good luck. You may remain senior devotee for a few billion lifetimes. And you will never become anywhere anyone else because you're a senior devotee, because this is material identification.
And you will always demand respect. Why Chaitanya Mahaprabhu stresses so much this third verse of Śikṣāṣṭaka because this is the state beyond ego.
Tṛṇād api su-nīcena no ego, no e not not even ego of a grass. Grass has some ego. I am a grass. It's a very low ego, but still it's an ego.
Chaitanya Mahaprabhu says: Tṛṇād api su-nīcena more tolerant, more humble than the grass, not even this ego. Then only the chanting will be pure chanting.
So it basically means that we should very carefully avoid this egoistic mentality while we're chanting, and
for that, before starting chanting, we have to really prepare who I am. We have to say, I am not this, I am not that, I'm nothing, I'm not this body. Let me chant without this. I am Gopi Barthur Pada Kamalaya.
My relationship with this the lover of gopis in Vrindavan. This is what I am, and this is how I chant. Otherwise, Ahamadi Paramo. I will remain in the center.
So I will confess to you now my own experience: what will happen, what happens when we chant.
You know, sometimes we chant and we feel a lot of satisfaction in the chanting, and we are uh you know we are somewhere in the different space. We are not in this material space.
Uh, by the mercy of the holy name, we are transferred into some other space where Krishna is there. We may not see him directly, but we kind of feel he is there and he's reciprocating with us. We chant and it's very nice.
But then something happens, you know, mm our false ego becomes uh alarmed and says, you know, something is wrong with you, you know, you are not with me anymore. You are somewhere beyond.
And false ego throws you into this into this space, into the material space which is limited by our false ego. And we we remain chanting.
The same track is going on Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare.
But it's not the same because already you have all concerns, and you think how you will enjoy next week and how you will enjoy next year, and how will you enjoy when you become sannyāsī and guru, and how you will enjoy when you get married, or how you will you know, this is all concepts which are flooding our consciousness as soon as we allow our false ego to influence our consciousness while chanting. And even though we are chanting, we're only thinking about how I will enjoy.
And in this world of our false ego, please notice it, take a note of it. In the world of false ego, everything is very clear. Everything is very understandable, you know.
In the world of false ego, you know all the information, you call this and that, you know, this is your enemy, this is your friend, this is your god friend, this is your competitor.
You know this is all your false ego defined everything. It's like you know dog.
When dog is going around every now and then he raises his leg and passes some urine because you know he says this is I know this tree, this is my tree. And to prove that this is my tree, there will be some urine of mine.
So the same way, the false ego, you know, it maps the world around you by different means, by putting different labels. This is good, this is bad, this is you know, this is myself.
And you live in this very narrow vault of your false ego and you try to chant Hare Krishna. Good luck. You know there will be no Hare Krishna. It will be just Hare Krishna Parad.
You know, so to chant clearly you have to go beyond. And for that you have to understand that I'm not this body. I'm I don't want to be limited by this body. I don't want to be, you know, I don't want to be senior devotee.
I don't want to be junior devotee. Caitanya Mahāprabhu himself says, I'm not senior devotee, I'm not junior devotee, I'm nobody, nobody of this world, Nahambarni, Nacha, Griapati, Navanastoya Tirva.
I'm not a sannyāsī. Not a sannyasi and this uh beautiful garland is not mine. Nothing of this.
So if we chant with this consciousness, how you know I'm I'm nobody and I have to tolerate including the onslaughts of my own ego. As soon as my own ego speaks something, I have to tell him: shut down.
I'm just, you know, gopī-bhartuḥ pada-kamalayor dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ. I don't care what you have to say. If we are very consistent with this, then very quickly the purification of consciousness will take place.
Very quickly, we will experience this results of the expansion of our consciousness. Very quickly, everything which is promised by Chaitanya Mahaprabhu in the first verse of Shikshastakum will take place.
But if not, if we insist in chanting within this little room of our false ego, little camera of our false ego, a little prison cell of our false ego, then it will be very difficult. It will take very long time.
It's a science. Therefore we have to recording stopped. We have to understand what's going on. Recording in progress. And we should try to chant uh as properly as possible. That means without false ego.
And as soon as we notice that we're again back to the prison cell of our false ego, where everything is very clear and very dirty and very, you know, and very familiar to us. We should just say, you know, I don't want to be in this prison cell anymore.
I've been in this prison cell for too long. I want to get free from this. So that's my little message.
And you know, connecting to the beginning of my class, I said that the government was trying to put devotees in prison in the Soviet Union and that was definitely not a very good thing.
But basically devotees knew that some devotees were put in prison. Some devotees did experience this very dramatic and traumatic, you know, events in their life when they were put in prison.
But amazingly they remained free even in prison. Why? Because they were chanting Hare Krishna.
This is exactly the story from Chaitanya Bhagavat when Haridas Thakur was put in prison and when he told all the prisoners just remain in this prison because in this prison you may be become free.
So the real way to freedom is chanting Hare Krishna when we can become free from this life sentence of our false ego.
We are all sentenced for life in our false ego, but there is a way to get free from this by chanting Hare Krishna. If I understand the science behind it, and I try to explain few aspects of this uh great science.
I'm really sorry for speaking so long. Thank you very much. Śrīla Prabhupāda ki jaya! Mahārāja, thank you so much. You you gave us so much to think about. I I really, really appreciate that.
Now I think the devotees maybe you can understand a little something why Maharaj is so popular in Russia and how powerful he is.
I'm so happy that you didn't just tell us some stories about Russia, rather you said something very important about our consciousness. I'd just like to ask Namitesh Gore Prabhu if he could organize the questions.
He he he usually does that really nicely. Can you do that Prabhuji? Krishna Maharaj. If we could hear more, have it whatever you told we noted down and we will try to think upon that.
There are some questions here and there uh tukarandrabhu has a question.
Questions on overcoming ego through service
I'll ask Tukaran Prabhu to start with. Well I would like to summarize what you have discussed. Please correct me if I'm wrong. So you told that prakṛti, which is in balanced state, so when there's a glance of Lord,
that is kāla and jīva enters to the and and because of the karma, so they enter into material uh rhythm. So then Mahatattva which is the first uh material uh kind
of there is an imbalance in prakṛti, this mahat-tattva is sad which is uh the which is the covering on the jīva or citta. Yes, correct. It's predominantly sattvic. It's a very great degree of sattva in Mahatattva.
Even though that there is no pure sattva because material sattva always mixed, but it's a very high degree of sattva in in this Mahatattva or originally now Chitta, without the influence of ego.
And Mahārāja told that this uh mahat-tattva because it is predominantly sattva, sattva-vṛt. So when it comes comes in contact with matter, just like water when it comes in contact with earth should become polluted.
So originally the qualities of mahat-tattva as you elaborated like sāvadhānam, that means that means transparent, clean, and pure. And that means that uh it it is actually uh bimba
right is reflecting uh the image of Lord, the name, form, qualities in its pure state. So, citta. And other is no vikāra. There is no vikar. That means laya and vikṣepa.
Just like when we are in deep sleep or we are in unconscious state laya, vikṣepa, so it is laya-vikṣepa-rahitam and then the third quality is śāntam, immovably or unshakably happy.
And then you define that happiness is the state of happiness expanded consciousness and unhappiness means contradicted consciousness. And you gave the example of when in ocean, when the glass of water is a small
consciousness and the ocean is big consciousness, and they are connected. So even if there is some pebbles, there is no difference. It does not make any difference.
But if the consciousness is contracted with the boundaries of false ego, that it are missing. So then there is then then there are disturbances when even a small pebble thrown.
So Maharaj, so we learned this and I just wanted like uh relate with like I was hearing two days back about Vṛtrāsura.
So Vṛtrāsura in uh and during his uh fight with Indra, so in a such moment also his consciousness is as you told uh unshakingly happy and Hagwar Timba Graytum, that is this completely pure, without any Ran, without any Dwesh.
So all so he actually he was because he was absorbed constantly in thinking about the Lord. In the con and Marath, you concluded by saying that pure chanting means when we do not have
when we have this consciousness that I am not, I am not, uh, varṇa, I am not śūdra, I am not sannyāsī, I am not, so the pure consciousness is, uh, pure consciousness is Ghokti Bhartupatkamaru das tasant. So Pritasar also had this consciousness that let me become the das and das of the degree.
So we go to get that. So I just like one could say Maharaj that just like when technical students sit together, they did not uh discuss uh externals, they discuss kind of like in electronics.
So those who go those are customers they see that what is on the display. But actually the engineers know what's going on the circuit. So you have actually revealed the circuit of Kṛṣṇa consciousness to us. Thank you.
Thank you. Some devotees have some questions for us from that sbaku will be defeated. And there also you told about how inside the highest stage it goes even to harbor emotions and starting from the Acha Dita Chaitanya.
Maharaspa, I have put a small question here.
That uh if this expanded consciousness is something which is free from the false ego. Now, a natural question will come out that when we are also trying to chant and we are also trying to become Krishna conscious, why this false ego is not leaking us and how we can attain to this state of expanding consciousness.
It's not leaving us because we are attached to it. You know there is certain attraction in this state of consciousness because everything is kind of familiar to us and we are controlling we have an illusion that we are controlling everything.
You know we know everything. This is when we are you know when we are in this uh state of uh spiritual consciousness without false ego everything is unknown to us you know it's it's a very insecure position in one sense.
Because you know, Krishna he's a supreme autocrat, what he will do next moment, and you know, I cannot control him. You know, it's very dangerous. So basically we are attracted to remain
in our you know it's like you know you're you're sitting in your little room and you know everything, and you you're going to some grocery shop and you you've been doing it for so many years, and then all of a sudden somebody tells you, you know now, you will go to America. And America is such a wonderful place. There are so many grocery shops there, and things like this.
And you say, no, no, no. I I don't need many grocery shops. I know something which is nearby and I know everything. So what I mean to say is that when we go to some other state
beyond our cons beyond our false ego, it may look very insecure, you know, because we are not in control there. We know that we are not in control there. Whereas in the world of our false ego, we are totally in control.
You know, we we know what will happen. You know, at least this is the illusion which we have. Of course, we are not in control here either.
So that's why people are a little attached to their little You know, and they are afraid to go to some expanded realm of consciousness where there's not much familiar. You know, we become a little afraid.
You know, if you go to Jagannātha Purī and you swim, of course you probably don't swim. But you know it's you know it's swimming without ocean. You're becoming secure and you feel better. I'll be in my little small space.
Where everything is so familiar and so you know controlled by me. Thank you, Maharaja. Well, yeah, when the sangha presents well and a devotee of our base, he's asking what's the softest and fastest means
of getting rid of all the false ego and expand our consciousness to pūrṇa, because it's a kind of this question. Uh the fastest way is to serve the devotees.
To serve basically everyone, to serve Śrīla Prabhupāda and his mission and to serve all the devotees in this mission. That's the fastest way. Because you know when we are attached to our ego,
our ego is always something, you know, which wants to lord it over. But when we become a servant of the devotees, it's it's the best way. The fastest way is not to become a senior devotee, is to remain a junior devotee.
If you always remain a junior devotee, that's the fastest way. As soon as you become a senior devotee, that's a very difficult and arduous way. And especially if you become a sannyāsī, that's a very difficult way.
Mārtaṇḍa Prabhu devotee asks him telling accept my obeisances how to deal with material and annoying people in day-to-day life.
Say it again what how to uh how to deal with material and annoying people in our day to nearly and you should not be annoyed. And then you will be able to deal.
If they are annoying and you are annoyed, then you will not be able to deal with them properly. So the first condition is that you know see why people are annoying because we take them too seriously.
Why our mind can be very annoying and agitating because we take our mind too seriously.
As soon as we, you know, don't take our mind too seriously, as soon as we don't take, you know, when there is a little child and the child may be very annoying.
He may be running here and there and yelling and you know crying and doing all kinds of things.
But if you don't take him too seriously, you know that it's just his childish tricks, then you will be able to calm him down very quickly.
But as soon as you become provoked by this child, agitated by the mischief of this child, you know it's not going to help. You will not be able to pacify the child, you will be only disturbed yourself.
So basically, not to deal properly means you don't take their minds too seriously. Don't deal with their minds. Deal with their soul.
We have to take them seriously, but as the spirit soul who wants love, who wants some spiritual relationship with Kṛṣṇa.
But if you deal if you take their minds too seriously, then you will be agitated and you will not be able to deal with them properly, and you will not be able to pacify them. So don't take their minds too seriously.
Just you know, say yeah, happens. Big thing you saw you saw that verse from Bhāgavatam, 5th Canto. There Prabhupada was saying that what is this pure state of consciousness which you explained in three qualities?
When we get to this pure consciousness, we can see the reflection of Supreme Personality of Godhead and also we can see our own existence or our own self.
I just want to say that what is really the difference between just seeing the Supreme Personality of Godhead and again seeing ourselves. Is there any difference or it's the same thing?
Uh it is explained many times by our ācāryas and Śrīla Prabhupada and in scriptures then you can only see yourself clearly when you see the Lord, because you cannot see yourself without the sun. The Lord is like the sun.
When the sun is there, you can see the sun and you can see yourself. When there is no sun, you don't see yourself. When it's pitch dark, you know. Then you don't see yourself and you don't see the sun.
So therefore, our way for self-realization, we emphatically say that there is no self-realization without God realization. You cannot understand yourself without realizing God.
So in one sense, it's the same because you can only see yourself when you see God. You can only realize who you are when some reflection of God when God is reflected in your consciousness,
Which is, as Prabhupada aptly say, which means Krishna consciousness. You know that's he says pure consciousness means Krishna consciousness, because when the consciousness is pure, Krishna is reflected there. His image is reflected there. Therefore, it's Krishna consciousness.
Thank you, Mahap. Madhaka actually I had heard from Mandy Bhauti of Purjata. He he is studying with your guidance the Sri Mathabotam full topic, Kanai Natsala Prabhu Purjata.
And he told me that how wonderful your classes had I could understand when I heard it today. Madam Prabhu I was just speaking to me.
Thank you so much Marja many things I I was thinking about but I I wanted to kind of stay out of the way and let uh the other devotees get some chance with you. Thank you again.
I I really liked your point about uh Upadis are like a dog passing urine and identifying this as myself because the Zupadis for the the consciousness of the conditioned souls are kind of violence. Yeah.
Because I I I own you, you are mine and that's uh just like the dog passing urine and this is my tree night place so this is upadhis are like passing year and I I really appreciate it so many wonderful points very very thoughtful I
I'm just so indebted to you, Maharaj. You really make us think in a very, very deep way. You speak in a very relevant way. I I know Rajabanita is here tonight too watching. She's in complete ecstasies. He's very happy.
And and I have to say you you're gonna cause yourself maybe some troubles by giving us class because now everybody here in in Arissa they're gonna want you to come. I'll come. I I I I love Arisa. I I'll come.
I will come for sure. But you can't just come in secret and say by yourself so have to come and give a class at the temple of Mubaneshwar. And you'll have to come and get to our ashram.
We have a nice guest room for you here. I'll definitely come. As soon as I can. Hare Krishna. Okay. So thank you again, Marla, so much. Tukaram Prabhu, do you want to add anything before we go? Let Maharaj go. Okay, thank you.
Thank you. Madhav to be very grateful to you for bringing Maharaj here on this platform. Thank you. Thank you. So just let us know when you're coming to Pori Maharesh. Yes. You will be the first one. You will be the first one.
And I know I I I if uh sometimes Anna Pioneers here, sometimes Raja Bonita may be here, they'll be in great ecstasy if you come. We have some cooks for you or someone like that too. Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much.
Hare Krishna. Śrīla Prabhupādakī jaya! Hare Krishna.