Srimad-Bhagavatam 2.7.2
Bhakti Vijnana Goswami · 2003
Chapters
Scriptural criteria for recognizing genuine avatars
Verizon chapter two, chapter seven, scheduled information, text number two. The Prajataki first, they got Shuyagya in the wound of the swife of Kiti.
And then Suyagya, they got demigod headed by Suyaman in the wound of his wife Kasi. Suyagya at the Indra there diminished very great misery of the three planetary systems, upper, lower and intermediate.
And because he so diminished the misery of the misery, he was led by by the great father of Manifat, namely the Andiromam.
In order to guard against the invention of un authorized information of God by the fanciful, less intelligent person. The name of father of the bona fide information is also mentioned in the authorized belief picture.
No one therefore can be accepted every information of the Lord that his father's name, as well as the name of the village of plague in which he appeared is not mentioned by that arise picture.
In the Baburat Purana, the name of Falk incarnation, which is to take place in almost four hundred thousand years, is mentioned along with the name of his father and the name of the village in which he will appear.
The statement, therefore, does not accept any shift de vision of any permission without repon to the authorized The Prajapati first begot Suyagya, in the womb of his wife haputis.
And then Suyagya, got Demigur headed by Suyamana, Suyamana, in the womb of of his wife wife haputis.
Sri Yatyan, as the Indra there, diminished very great miseries of the three planetary seasons upper, lower, intermediate.
And because he so diminished the miseries of the human race, he was later called Harish, called Harish, a rebread father of mankind, namely Forandiraman.
So Lord Jama is describing different information for avatars s of the Lord. It's a technically called lila avatar.
And takes advantage of this description in this particular verse to tell us about the signs of how to recognize the information. In fact, it's a very essential point of our philosophy that God can come.
And that's the unique point of our philosophy. Because if you take any other religious philosophy, then and there is no concept of Avatar. Recently I read a book by one Christian writer. And that's the book against Hindus.
He's critically describing the Hindus and all the egos of Hindus and the evil history of Hindus and all the demigods of fighting to each other and how immoral they are and he says, know, look at this kind of god you so so many things he has to say.
But the main accusation at the very end was exactly about this concept of Avatar and why is it so important for him that this is the main accusation he said the whole India he's actually you know you know blasting and condemning to actually do everything I only read it because somebody asked me to say what I think about.
Otherwise, they're in theory. It's quite blessed and good. But at the end he says that the whole India is the fortress of seven. This is the most satanic country in the world. Why? Because there is this concept of Avatar.
And because of the concept of Avatar, when Christians go there, they cannot do nothing. Because they say, Jesus Christ, Jesus come to save you. He is an Avatar. Yes, there many Avatars out there. What's the big deal?
You know, if you go to any other country, you say, Jesus saved you.
It's a huge He is saving, is coming because this is the beauty of the Lord. He has to say it's not that you know it is somehow rather neglected or forgot about some other countries. He is coming all the time.
It's not but he's saying that you know Indians are so condemned. They are so with such a fallen unfortunate people. They will never be able to understand this is the Jewish Christ is the only one.
But the point is that he's not the only one. And he cannot be the only one. Because he cannot reconcile this concept of one descent, divine descent. If the Lord is all merciful.
Divine descent as essential mercy for bound souls
How you can imagine that, you know, the old merciful Lord would wait for thousands and millions of years and then only send just somebody you know and then that's it.
The lord is always coming and his role and the creation is to help the foreign condition souls. Otherwise, there would not be chance for the foreign condition souls to raise up from this conditioned state of consciousness. And that's a very essential point and this is being explained by Chetanya Mahrabhu Sanatim in the Pentech chapter of Madelila in Sanatamu Siksa, our Lord Chetanya is describing this descent of of the Lord. And he's saying a very essential thing.
He says that Krishna Krishna buddhyā. It means that that bahir-mukha, that the jīva, being envious of Krishna, forgot about Krishna.
And because the jīva forgot about Krishna, there is no chance in the heart of jīva for the knowledge about Krishna to rise again on its own accord.
That's a very essential point that basically the point which is making is that you cannot really be saved upon your own, on yourself. You need the mercy.
That this means not natural or self-perceived to a knowledge which is coming on its own accord. It cannot really be awakened in the heart of jīva without the external help.
Because jīva became Krishna-bahir-mukha, and bahir-mukha means bahir means outside. And basically it means bahir-mukha means envious, but bahir-mukha literally means that you turned away from the Lord.
And as soon as jīva turned away the face, in space, bahir means outside. You know, she looked outside of the Lord. She doesn't want to see the Lord. She turned her back towards the Lord.
And because the jīva at this moment sees so many other things, there is no chance for remembrance of the Lord to be arisen again in her heart, in his heart only. In his heart also.
And therefore, in order for jīva to become Krishna-conscious instead of being Krishna-bahir-mukha, to become Krishna-conscious or again remembering Krishna, for that reason there should be some external help, and therefore Sanātana Gosvāmī says, therefore Krishna sends or Krishna Himself comes here, and he comes here and he writes—therefore, this is the reason why Krishna is coming as an avatāra, why Krishna is coming as Vyāsadeva to remind the jīvās about Krishna.
So, in fact, this is the science. Krishna is coming here as Vyāsadeva to remind jīvās and he's writing Vedas and Purāṇas so that this knowledge about the Supreme Lord would be awakened in the heart.
Fraudulent claims and abuse of incarnation status
And this is a great science how to recognize, and this particular chapter is also written by—so the science about incarnation is described in literature.
And the science is there for us to understand who is an avatāra and who is not. But as Prabhupāda points out in his purports, there are so many people who abuse the science.
So many people who take advantage of this concept of incarnation and saying, you know, I'm the incarnation. We have one great incarnation living in South India.
He's more than 70 years old, he's short, he has, you know, this fire, you know, around him. He's very famous. He has millions and millions of followers.
I don't know how many millions, but he claimed that he has at least 10,000,000 followers. I read, you know, it's really funny. There are these three stories about him in their birthplace.
So somebody asked me about him, you know, because he's always, you know, showing some ghosts and astrals and giving some voices, you know, material ones to his followers, making so many other, you know, divine relations.
So somebody asked me about him and I was looking at that place and there was some humor of this information. So then anecdotes about this information.
So one of his followers is asking, dear avatāra, can you please explain to me that reading the scriptures that avatāra is full of knowledge and spirit and beauty and strength and opulence?
You know, why are you so sure? You know, because you're an avatāra, you're God. You could have accepted any other form.
And at the certain Viṣṇu Purāṇa Parāśara gives the description of God, whenever God comes, even if He comes in a form of a tree, He's a more beautiful tree, you know, as well. Yadu-rāṇī vaṁśa, you know, how so like the tree lost water? And he said, you just, you know, paint a very beautiful tree. Whatever it is.
Anyway, so this this opulences of the supreme world is always present. And whatever avatar and whatever determinations becomes. The opulence is there and this opulence is the fame and the beauty.
So, one of the followers of this incarnation was asking, why did you take such a strange form? You're small and you know, really beautifully lucky. This guy mentioned me, like, famously answering me. Yes.
I could have been, you know, a big guy, you know, four minutes of fire, three minutes of time. No problem for me. But women like this position of course. He's supposed to listen, yes. At the same time.
It's the reason of his divine incarnation in this particular form. It's a premium like the, you know, quite a share. First, you see. Anyway, this is the abuse of the science.
And Prabhupāda takes advantage of this description, and he's saying that in order to guard against this abuse of the science, the scriptures mention where the incarnation comes, at what time he comes, and what particular mission he's supposed to do.
And particularly here the līlā-avatāra is being described, one of the incarnations among the demigods. Because it is said that Krishna is taking birth when he comes to the earth. He's taking birth in every species of life.
He's taking birth in the animal species. He's taking birth in among the demigods and among the human beings. So he's planning for this particular purpose.
And the scriptures especially which are describing them are of worshiping the Lord. Of reestablishing the God consciousness within the heart of jīva, through worship specifically.
So Āgama-śāstras, they are describing different levels of incarnation. And they are describing how God comes in different incarnations and why he comes in this particular form.
Five classifications of divine descent in Agama shastras
Form. So, in Āgama-śāstras it is said that there are five particular forms of the Lord. And one of the ācāryas commenting on this point, he described the descent of the Lord as the flood.
Because the Lord being whole merciful, being full of mercies. Because he's karuṇāmaya, he's kṛpāmaya, he's made of mercy.
Because he's so merciful, he's coming, and this mercy is like a flood, so he's describing these different incarnations in terms of the flooding of the universe, and he's saying that the first form of the Lord or the first category,
There are many forms in each category of the descent. But the first category of the Lord is called parā. And parā means transcendental. Parā means completely spiritual.
And parā means the Lord and the forms of the Lord which are there in the spiritual world.
So, and this ācārya, he said this is like the—he's comparing it to the waters of the Cāraṇa-udadhi ocean which are all around the universe. You see, what we call...
He says that basically the universe is like a small little bubble, and this bubble is in the ocean of the Cāraṇa-udadhi ocean, and the Cāraṇa-udadhi ocean are the transcendental waters of this Cāraṇa-udadhi ocean.
So he's saying that, you know, the first flood is this flood of the Cāraṇa-udadhi ocean, and this is compared with the form that was the descended form of the Lord.
Then the next form of the Lord by which he's coming here in this universe is called vyūha. Third, we know this concept, and that there are four incarnations of the Lord coming from Vāsudeva.
They are taking existence, and from Vāsudeva, Pradyumna and Aniruddha and Saṅkarṣaṇa actually the living beings take birth. Because Vasudev being the of the Supreme Lord Himself, his presiding deity.
And then Sankarshan is the presiding deity of Jiva, of this incarnation because the Jiva ultimately is coming from Sankarshan.
And then there is predhina which is the predominated deity of the mind and then there is anirudha who is the predominated deity of the old figure of a Sankarshan.
In any case, this is being described also in same the chapter of satanic sarikamritin. So this is the next level, yuhha, which facilitates the functioning of the universe.
It basically facilitates this is the mercy of the Lord because by the means of this yuhha or foreign carnations the Jeevas are being controlled.
They're being created and they're being controlled and they're being guided in this material universe because the mind is there, the whole figure is there and the Lord is there himself.
And then the next level of incarnation and he's comparing this muco incarnation with the blood of milk, of the mucosm, which is also sometimes being overflooded.
And then he says that sometimes from this new portion of from this new incarnation, the debauve incarnation is coming. And the debauve is like the flood in this in this earth.
Sometimes God descends from the spiritual world first from the spiritual world to Vaikuntha planet within this universe. From Vaikuntha planet within this universe, he sometimes come to perform lila.
And this lila avatar, different lila avatars are called debug. And they're like flat. When the Lord comes in his lila avatar, everyone is totally immersed in the thinking about things.
Because what he does, when he performs this lila, it's so wonderful that nobody can think about anything else now this avatar of actually I recently read open into my sister here because there is a source of information about another avatar the avatar for the age, you know.
He was living somewhere in Australia. He's mainly he may have about something like this. He's angry looking person who looked like this. Another avatar.
But the point is that when the lila avatar come, when Deebab comes, why it's called flood? Because everyone is over flooded by this mercy. Like a he called Jesus Christ as Shakti Avesha Avatar.
Why he called Jesus Christ Shakti Avesha Avatar?
Because of the influence which which Shakti Avesha Avatar he is doing because the influence of Jesus Christ he's coming and everyone is you know no matter who you are, what you are doing, you still know about him and you know that he did something from there.
So, this is one of the signs of Lila Avatar.
Lila Avatar when he's punished because he's performing Lila and this Lila has this spiritual nature completely totally absolutely spiritual nature everyone's attention is totally absorbed in this Lila you know and who knows about this baba, you know, somewhere in Australia, who is absorbing this lila.
And what is interesting because he will is that, you know, he's looking for, you know, whatever else he's doing. I don't know. But nobody is really into it. I mean, you know, it's few thousand followers.
It's not really a vibhav avatar. Because vibhav means plot and everyone is over flooded by the nursery which is emanated from the heart of this avatar. And then the next level of information is called Antaryanik.
An Antaryanik says when the flood, you know, when the flood is going and then when the flood is coming down, then the water is still there. It's underneath the earth. It's it's not visible, but the water is there.
There is a lot of water underneath the earth. And he says this Avtaryani is compared with this water, with the source of water which is underneath this earth.
The Avtaryani is in the heart and the description of Avtaryani, of Paramatma, a Lord in the heart of all living entities, is also being given in the chapter.
And then he said, when the flood is is going to wake, then there are some little water on the surface. Some most of the water goes down under the underneath the earth.
But some little water on the surface is remaining like, you know, little puddles are there. Know, the flood is gone but puddles are soon there. So he says this is Arch Avatar. This is the fifth level of Avatar.
The Arch Avatas are remaining here.
Identity and hidden nature of Lord Chaitanya
Just to give the access to the service and and then after that from this description, the signs of worshiping Arch Avatar is being described in where his scientist is described.
In any case, the point is that the Lord is coming to give mercy. And it's a great sign how to recognize Avatar. And because we are celebrating birth for Nima tomorrow. I think it's appropriate if I have some time.
Do I have some? No help. Anyway, so so the point is because we're celebrating Caitania Avatar, we're celebrating the descent or appearance of Lord Kritania.
It's very appropriate to say a few words about this Avatar because tomorrow we will speak more about this.
But today is a very alter, good reason we have to speak about satania avatar because sometimes we may wonder if he is good or not. Because after all we worship him. He's there on our altar.
You know we come and we tempt his full name. But sometimes you know we may have some doubt. You know. But if he's got or not. And it's no wonder because not only we have done so many other people do have done.
Of course when he came and when he was there people or you know millions of people were abroad and he's lila But he is not a Lila Avatar. This is a very central point.
He is not coming as Lila Avatar because God is called free yugas. The yuga means that in Kali Yuga there is no Lila Avatar. In any other yuga there is a yuga avatar o lila avatar who is coming. But not in Kali Yuga.
There is no lila avatar in Kali Yuga. In Kali Yuga the Lord is coming in His Chan avatar and His hidden powers.
And there is a very nice and interesting description of the dispute which took place between Sarvabamba and his brother-in-law working at a chariot.
Because when Sarvabamba first saw Lord Chitanya he immediately from the first look he was struck with wonder.
He saw this tall figure extremely beautiful and the first thing that he saw which he noticed was it beautiful for you child his you know I offer to a seven and that's you know completely perfect figure and everything and when he saw Lord Chicanion when he saw how Lord Chicanion faded his first initial thought was this is God.
First initial doubt which was there in mind. Is it Lord Jaganath himself or not? You know, he's there in the temple and he sees his you know, beautiful scene of painting for Lord Shitany.
Then Lord Shitany is is running towards Lord Jaganath and he's fainting it because of the love which is here in his heart. And then he takes him home and he examines very carefully because he's a great scientist.
Very carefully what's happening with Lord Sutani and he ultimately understands that he has all the ecstatic symptoms which are there described in the shatras and not only all the ecstatic symptoms but all the symptoms of spiritual ecstasy which manifests in the highest possible form.
And not only symptoms which manifest in the highest possible form but altogether which practically impossible for human beings. That human body is not capable of bearing all these symptoms altogether.
He is not just in Samadhi. He is in Mahamahamaha Samadhi. Know, Samadhi is a dangerous thing, you know. You may go in Samadhi and never return from Samadhi.
So he's examining all the symptoms in the body of Lord Sitanya and he says this, you know, understanding is he good or not? This something divine because normal ordinary human being cannot really manifest it.
But then, you know, Bokinada Kerry comes and he's at the who is this country actually?
And Bokinada Kerry says, yo, he's from Navadvik his father is Jaganath Mishra and his grandfather and Sarvabombatacha said, oh, Nila and Nila. Now I understand. He's very cute and young. He's getting nice, young boy, the cute and young because he's completely writes too much. I will help him.
So immediately somehow and he knows Jaganat Misra is a poor Raman. He's not even very weak, you know. And immediately he developed this kind of negligence or kind of, kind of, how do feel this? Familiarity, yes.
We developed this familiarity with lot of Krishna and he immediately takes some kind of superior obusive because Sarvabam Vatacharya is he's great.
I mean Sarvabam Vatacharya we don't know much about him but the people who know the history of of Indian philosophy for them he is one of the greatest figure in the whole history of Indian philosophy.
Sarvabamba Thacarya what what was there actually Sarvabam Bhattacharya was the first one who introduced Nyaya school in Navadviv. Navadviv was famous all over India because Navadviv was the center of learning.
But the only thing which was missing in Navadviv is Nyaya education. Education. In Navadviv you could get any education possible, but not Nyaya. And the Nyaya school was developed by Dihari Pandur.
And Dihari Dihari they're not really very brainy. Bengalis they're famous for doing very brave. I had a personal experience over it. They have stolen my computer. I was there for a few days only and I lost my computer.
It's a dangerous place.
But somehow rather than the Biharis, they developed Nyaayah on a very high level and because they were afraid of the competition with the Bengalis, if they had some, you know, some Bengalis union, they would teach Nyaayah to them but they will never give the handbook.
They were written elaborate handbook, you know, very details about Nyaayah logic and the students would come and they would go back and they couldn't really establish the school of Nyaayah in Bengal.
So Sarvabam Bhattacharya when he came, he came to Bihar to learn Yaya and then to learn Yaya he learned the whole book by heart. But you know huge book everything he told us the most subtle analysis which was there.
He went by far and he came back and he wrote his own handbook about Tihyaya which was much higher than the other one. And in this way they superseded the whole Biharis and established the glory of Nawaldi.
Then Sarvabamba Thakari was the most brilliant scholar in the whole of Navadvi, which was the most brilliant seat of learning in the whole of India at that time, which was the most intellectual country in the whole of the world.
So, at this particular time, Sarvabamba Thakari was basically the most genius person in the earth. Of course, besides close to him. That's another thing where she can go.
So, Sarvabamba Thakari, he has this And behind him actually Sarabhavamatacharya had such a brilliant student. His students are still famous.
The students of Sarabhavamatacharya, they wrote a standard book which is still being studied in the classical Bengali education.
You know, Ragunat he wrote Ragunandan wrote smriti, which is the standard Smriti for all the Brahmanas. All the Brahmanas are living according to this work of Sarvabamba, Hesaya's purity. Then that's Ragunandan Smriti.
Then Ragunat is the most brilliant of all and then there is was another student who who wrote about the signs of tantra how to do all the rituals properly.
So basically Sarabhavaumbata cherry is the most knowledgeable scholar in all the world at that time. So he's there in Puri and Lotshitan is coming because he's changed because Lotshitan is very comfortable.
And Lord Titania says, All the things about Christmas. I'm not Narayana. They think about Christmas. Don't think about me.
So, and then Sarvabam Bhattacharya developing this familiarity, he says, you know, such a beautiful young and you know how he will be able to maintain this valve it's very difficult it's not so easy to do especially if you're young especially if you're so beautiful and especially if you are singing and dancing, especially because if you sing and dance over, maybe.
And how did you take some dancer? And anyway, if you took Sanja, you soon sing and you soon dance because all the relics and these pages are pretty cool. He says to go to Mattacari, okay.
He beloved the compassionate this part. He says, I am very compassionate to this young boy. I like him. He's so beautiful. He he instructs his mind. Yeah. And and then he says I will teach him the dance.
And that will help him to maintain his cushion of it. Will teach him the dance. Go to that I say it is yours. You are a haradi. You are blessed to me. You will teach Vedanta to the supreme lord.
Who you are to teach Vedanta to the supreme lord. You don't know anything. He says gentleman. You are right now. He says, it's you are fool. You are, you don't know anything.
And then there is a discussion or dispute between the two. And everyone is saying, you're fool. You don't know, you And they actually cannot really cannot really understand each other. Is saying he's incarnation.
He's God himself. And said, you know, this is sentimental. How you will prove it? How how you will really prove it? He says, no, he just he took Sanyaz. Look, can he be incarnation?
He took Sanyaz in some interior second or third class Sampradhaya. You know, he's not even Saraswathi. He's just he's just a Bharathi. What kind of panyansis he is.
I will teach him and I will give him re initiation into Saraswathi Sampradhaya. I will become him hero. And actually at that point the pride is there in the heart of Sarva Gongathacharya.
He wants to become guru of this thing. He wants to become even more famous by by taking position of guru of this beautiful man.
Scriptural proofs predicting Chaitanya Mahaprabhu
So, and Godinata charity is saying, it's very interesting what he said. He said, you will never be able, how you will prove? Sarawam Nachher is asking. How you will prove that he is the information?
And Godinata charity says, you know, the statements from the vedas and puranas are there. It is said in Mahabharata, in the Vishnu Sahasra naam. And Vishnu Sahasra naam is the most famous and the most standard description of the Lord. And all the incarnations of the Lord are there.
Vāmana, Narasiṁha and all other incarnations are there. Thousand names of Vishnu are there.
And there in this Vishnu Sahasra-nāma there is this famous verse to varṇa-varṇaṁ avaraṁ that the Lord is coming and He's taking sannyāsa and His color of the skin is like suvarṇa. Suvarna means gold.
He's molten golden by his complex appearance and he is more peaceful. He's śānta and he's distributing śānta, the peace all over the world. Like yesterday this man who wanted to speed up the distribution is movement.
Later I spoke with him and his main concern goes, look, there's so many wars are there and now the war is the era is looming ahead of us. Why don't you do something about this? Why not we stop it?
So this understanding is there. Lord Caitanya is coming to stop the war. It is said in this verse of Mahābhārata that he's the most peaceful himself and he's spreading the peace around him.
And he's two varṇa-varṇa, he's taking sannyāsa. And Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya is asking, Who is this in fāma? Tell me. Look, he's golden. He's in front of you.
You examined all the symptoms in his body and you even saw that he's got sannyāsa.
But then because your heart is iron, is made from iron, you couldn't really understand it, please God. Because you have this stone heart, couldn't see it.
You know, it's there and it's also there very clearly, in the very clear terms in the eleventh canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam where it is said that what is this?
Also very clear verses there and so many other verses in the seventh canto of and then Prahlāda Mahārāja is saying that he is the nṛsiṁha avatāra, siṁha avatāra and giving description of the so the predictions are there, but it is just superstitious. It's just, you know, full faith.
Know, yeah, we know, we're the sentimental source.
And then Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya makes a very important statement he says you will never be able to understand the supreme Lord unless you get a mercy of teerth and he quotes the words from the tenth canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, You will never be able to understand the real glory of the Lord. Unless you get even a little speck of mercy. To understand the glory of the Lord. We have to get the mercy of the Lord. First.
And that maybe that maybe considered as a very dubious statement. As a very doubtful statement. Because it's kind of circular logic.
You know, you can understand the Lord, you can't understand the Lord unless you get the mercy. And then when you get the mercy, understand that please the Lord. And it's it's it's like it's not very logical.
So Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya says, how do you know that I don't have the mercy? What is the proof? You say, how do you know? Because, doctor.
Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya says, I know he's the Lord, you don't know that he's the Lord. Why? We all seen him. We have all seen him. But I understand that he's the Lord. You don't understand that he's the Lord.
The reason why because I have the nurse, you don't have the nurse. Why you saw obnoxious? Why didn't say I don't have the nerve? Why do you why you're so bold by saying that you have the nerve and I don't care?
What is the truth? Tell me, let's be scientific, let's be scorer. And then what did MK say? Yes, yes, you are scorer. No, You are the greatest caller. You are the biggest caller of a call.
But you're deprived of using this stack of university. And the reason is that because you actually knowing creators, don't know the essence of the verse. You don't know Vastu.
You don't know the person God and you don't understand how God manifests himself. And he gives the proof. The proof he says Vastu Tatva Jn.
He says the proof of the nursery that you can understand that the mercy is there if you are having this understanding of Vastu of the S.
This understanding is coming, it's not that, you know, the learning or the knowledge is not that, you know, some verses, you can quote some slocus you know some logic you know some tricks how to convince others.
No the logic and the proof that you have mercy is should manifest within your personality should manifest basically in every action which you do.
The proof that you have Norship should manifest in your lifestyle, in your relationship to this. Praupati gives a very beautiful purpose to this Lord.
He says that the Lord who then should be the the appearance of the Lord. The the proof that somebody has mercy is that he understands that the Lord is already there.
That he understands that the Lord is into them as this that he he case in particular way or relate to this world in a particular way and he understands that this is the Lord's energy. That's the proof.
The proof of the mercy from the Lord is is manifesting in a particular in the whole you know being of the human being in his in his in everything basically that's what it is and basically, Coppinatha Chari says, only the devotee can understand the Lord.
Only if the sign of the Lord is that you become a devoted lord. Like all these devotees who were living before Lord Sitanya's descent. They knew they were the Lord. They were worshiping the Lord.
And when Lord Sitanya came, they all recognized him, he's the Lord. So the proof is that first you become the devotee. First you worship the Lord. First you chant His Holy Name. First you behave and live as a devotee.
And this is already the proof that you have some nursery. And then because you have this nursery and you see the Lord Himself, you will recognize this is the Lord.
And when you see the bogus incarnation with the fuzzy hair, you will say it is bogus. Like in '74, one incarnation came to Bombay. His name was Guru Maharajji.
And then Guru Maharajji also was mustars and was beer, it was her hope, you know.
And Praupat was there with with and this and that and so he went to Jukuti for his morning walk and he asked his disciples you tell me how to disprove that he is in tarnishing how to prove that he is not that he is broken And then once somebody says, you ask, you should ask him to show the universe for him.
How far did he pursue it? He says, no. You know, he may always say, you know, I will not show it to you. You you you don't have the eyes to see my universe. You know, this is not. He he didn't agree with this.
And then somebody else said, you know, that information should be there in the śāstras and should mention his name, and this is how Prabhupāda says here.
There and even read in newspaper that this guru Maharaj-ji had a big gathering of people, and one little short Indian lady, pious lady, she became so indignant that this guy is saying that he is the Lord.
So she came and she took a piece of cake and was threw the cake, and he was there, this incarnation, with the cake and the cake.
I think by itself, look, this little lady threw the cake, and this is the incarnation, and she was there with this. Yes. This is the correct proof. Prabhupāda was very agile. Said, yes. This is the truth.
And he involves little humor, you know, pious lady. Because she's pious.
Because she's pious, she has this you know anger in her heart, and somebody says, "Thank you, the Lord, you know, worship me," and she takes the piece of cake and swims and peaks, because if somebody is an incarnation and he meets somebody who is really pious, who is really devoting heart at heart, then immediately some kind of understanding that he's God himself comes into the heart.
You know, some kind of understanding is there.
You read about Prabhupāda and you have this kind of feeling, he's God, you know, you read about Viṣṇu or Rāmacandra, you know, he's God, but if you are atheist at heart, you may know, you may be the greatest holder of the dead.
Historical accounts of divine revelation to devotees
If you're atheist at heart, you will never know. Like, there is, I will tell a little story, and then I might have told the story about one sannyāsī, the name of Kṛṣṇa-kānta. And he was a veteran.
He was from India himself, and he became a disciple of White Swami, yes. Even before Prabhupāda or even before any disciples, then he started to go.
Was In the thirties or maybe not, but approximately at the same time, the second half of the Second World War. And the second did they tell you the first? Anyway, during the Second World War, he was the pilot.
He was a very educated man, theologist, the expert in British law. During the second World War, he was a pilot, and his plane was shot by a German. And the plane started falling down.
And you know it's a quite critical situation. Although it doesn't take much time. But during this situation, you know, the time becomes very long.
Whoever was in the accident you know knows that you know, the the very short time becomes psychologically becomes very long. So he's the plane is falling, and he starts praying to the Lord.
Because at that moment, you know, you don't have any other one to to pray to. You know? Not a help. And he's crying and he's, you know, yelling to him, Save me! Save me! Save me!
And at this particular moment he feels some force.
And is forced to, you know, to feel a very, you know, obvious presence of some force within this place, and somehow or other he loses consciousness, and the next time he opens his eyes in the hospital, somehow or other he survived, and it was a miracle.
He couldn't understand why this miracle was there.
And when he was praying to the Lord, he said, oh Lord, if you save me, then for the rest of my life I will be searching for you. And unless I will find you, I will not get peace. I want to see you, I want to find you. So, when he is in the hospital, she has this mission in life, I want to find you, I want to see you.
And he gets out from the hospital and he goes to different ashrams in England and asks me, Can I see the Lord? Because I promised to the Lord that I want to see him. And when he was in the hospital, he heard the word.
Every now and then the voice would come both in the world he didn't he didn't regard the truth. But then he goes back to England. He was in a hospital in France and he said, can I see the Lord?
And he said, but no, we cannot see the Lord. We cannot show you the Lord. You want to see the Lord, you go to India. Right there, I mean, before they they claim they can see the Lord. They go to India.
And he hears for the second time, go to India. He says, you know, I have not gone to India. So he goes to India. It's a long story. He first becomes Buddhist, you know, trying to meditate according to Buddhist tradition.
Then he becomes shy of this and that. He he tries everything.
Finally, ultimately he becomes Gaudiya Vaishnava. It's a long story how to detect Gaudiya Vaishnavas, but he's convinced this is the Lord. He took initiation from some Radharamana dasa in Vrindavan ultimately, and he's coming there seeing Radharamana. He's seeing the Lord and he's talking to Radharamana. He has some, you know, some experiences, divine experiences.
Radharamana wants to talk with you. But still he has doubts. He took initiation in this Gaudiya sampradaya. He has doubts for the Lord. He's convinced Krishna is the Lord.
He knows Radharamana is the Lord. He worships Radharamana. There is no doubt, there is no slight doubt of his might. He chants the holy name. He doesn't listen. Still, he has doubt. His loyal lord.
Mind you, Jesus and all that is some sleepy person. You know? So, and he he cannot find the rest.
And we know that actually Radharamana is Lord Chaitanya himself. Because Radharamana, how far Radharamana appeared, Lord Chaitanya when he went to the South and he stayed in Srirangam in Venkata Bhatta's family. Then this Gopala Bhatta in the future Goswami also jumped to. And Lord Chaitanya said to him, oh man, you become older. And he's serving him and he's such a nice young boy and he knows that Gopala Bhatta at that time he also saw the vision.
He saw the vision of the Lord in all his glory. Because you know, his servant Lord is is is Sanyasi and he's crying within his heart. I never saw his never be clever.
When the Lord is working, when he's young and he has long curly hair and and he's enjoying.
You know, for devotees it's painful to see Lord Caitanya as a sannyāsī, the shaven head. The what if they never really depict Lord Caitanya as a sannyāsī? Because he's taking unnatural role, he's taking austerities. The devotees like to see the Lord and enjoy it.
So this Gopāla Bhaṭṭa young boy, he's crying within his heart, I didn't see the Lord in his glory and his opulence. I only see him as a sannyāsī, a mendicant, and he doesn't even take service. Them, you can put in so many juices, you can, you know, but the sannyāsīs, they're austere. You can really do anything to them. If they're real, they're not real.
Sannyāsī does accept service. This profile matters. He's suffering within his heart. And he's begging to the Lord. Show me your glory and opulence.
And at one point he he's there by Lord Caitanya, by the feet of course in time and he sees this vision of glorious Lord in Navadvīpa and all the incarnations of the Lord. Avasara in him and he sees that his divine form.
Anyway, Gopāla Bhaṭṭa is serving him for four months. And before leaving Śrīraṅgam, Lord Caitanya states. When you get older, you go to Vrindavan. And then I will come to you.
And I'd do the līlā again in Vṛndāvana. And Gopāla Bhaṭṭa gets older. He goes to Vrindavan. And he remembers this promise of the Lord.
The Lord told me, I will come to you, I will come to you, I will be with you again. Because all the time he is in the, in the separation with the Lord, he is suffering, he is crying. But the Lord is not coming.
And then he finds out that the Lord is gone. That the Lord can fool it, you know, and he has never seen him.
Only for four months in Śrīraṅgam and he has never come back to Vṛndāvana. He was waiting and waiting and waiting for him in Vṛndāvana. But he cheated him.
Gopāla Bhaṭṭa at that time, he's a brother. You know, severe, lonely. How how come you didn't come? You promised and you didn't come.
And then few days later, the Lord, the Rādhā-ramaṇa from his Śālagrāma-śilā, Rādhā-ramaṇa of his. And Rādhā-ramaṇa is Lord Caitanya himself.
He came because of this longing for Gopāla Bhaṭṭa to meet again. He he actually fulfilled his promise.
The Lord Caitanya came in the form of Rādhā-ramaṇa because Rādhā-ramaṇa doesn't have—Rādhārāṇī isn't beside him. Rādhārāṇī is inside. Lord Caitanya is inside Kṛṣṇa, outside Rādhā-ramaṇa.
And Рада-Раман is outside Кришны, inside Рада-Раман. Is he is is hidden Lord Читанья. Rādhārāṇī is the hidden hidden manifestation manifestation of Lord Caitanya.
So, Rādhāramaṇa is Lord Caitanya himself and this Kṛṣṇa prema he he's asking Rādhāramaṇa, how can I understand that Lord Caitanya is God? So, he goes to to Rādhāramaṇa and he prays with you.
And he say, please prove me that Lord Caitanya is God. Unless you prove me that Lord Caitanya is God, I will never be able to accept it.
When he goes to sleep and they sleep, Rādhāramaṇa comes to sleep and Rādhāramaṇa is in a very jolly mood and he says, you don't believe that Rādhāramaṇa is God, right? He says, no, I don't believe.
I believe yoga. I agree to worship you but not give. Never. And then next morning he says, he doesn't see Rādhāramaṇa anymore. This is Lord Caitanya, Lord Caitanya is not. That's me. Don't you see you are the same?
You know, I mean, I came because of him only. That's me. Anyway, he walked up and he convinced me. Surrender. He's gone. You convinced me. So that's the point.
The point is that ultimately if we want to know somebody's information of the Lord can know, we have to find the great devotee of the Lord. And we have to ask the great devotee of the Lord.
Someone who's totally absorbed, thinking of the Lord, changing his holy name, treading his glory all over his place and asking, is he God or not? And his answer should be the authority to answer for us.
Otherwise, the doubts will only be they are in our past, you know. The the only the devotee because the devotee is the recipient of the nurse of the Lord. He can determine whether somebody is the information or not.
Direct spiritual perception versus material senses
Everyone else will be thrown to the cheapest by all the all the speakers. The question is that in the Bhagavad-gītā... If you come to Somalia, am. That's that.
This knowledge is supposed to be a per caption you. Per caption means you have this working experience of this of this knowledge. At the same time, it is certain Narada-pancaratra.
You don't look at it because they're not about it yet. You can't repeat it, and they said the Lord by by your blood. No pido el temple. By only when he wants to reveal himself, she can reveal to you.
But it's very easy to understand, because the Bhagavad-gītā stresses not the taste, but the experience. The Bhagavad-gītā Krishna says that this knowledge you have to get experience of.
It means that you should not do the blind deliver. You should not just blindly believe that this the way and because how how you should do. Ultimately, you have to have the spiritual experience.
And the verse in Narada Pancaratras says that you cannot get the experience by your material senses. So it's not these verses are not really contradicting each other.
The verse in Nārada-pañcarātra says you will get the experience and the verse in Bhagavad-gītā says that you will not get the experience by the material senses.
But you will get the experience when the Lord will be merciful, that the Lord will Himself reveal to you. And in the same words of Nārada-pañcarātra said that how to get the mercy.
To get the mercy, you have to engage your senses in the service to the Lord, starting with the tongue. So this is the way to obtain the mercy ultimately. You first engage your senses, then the senses become purified.
When the senses are purified, then the senses will be capable of getting or acquiring the spiritual skills, as proclaimed there by Kṛṣṇa in the Bible. No, no.
No, no, not through material senses because, yes, pratyakṣa, but pratyakṣa also Kṛṣṇa says in Bhagavad-gītā, the eleventh chapter of the Bhagavad-gītā, As you say, I'll give you the divine action. There are divya-cakṣu.
There is prākṛta-cakṣu. Prākṛta-cakṣu. The material eye. And the divine eyes.
So, the point is that the Lord has to give you and then you will get with this. Now, vision is there, that you can only experience the Lord with your divine senses, but divine senses, you will get from the Lord by the mercy of the Lord.
Like, Dhṛtarāṣṭra was blind, right? He couldn't see. He's materialist but totally blind.
So once, when Duryodhana was trying to capture Kṛṣṇa in the assembly hall of Kurus, the blind Dhṛtarāṣṭra there, and it's Sañjaya is describing what's going on.
And saying, you know, this is entering the court and who knows? And then, you know, so many other things are happening and Sañjaya is describing to Dhṛtarāṣṭra his reactions accordingly.
And at one point, Duryodhana wants to capture Krishna. And Krishna is just laughing at him. He wants to tie him up and put him in prison.
And at one point, Duryodhana wants to capture Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa is just laughing at him, he wants to tie him up and put him in prison, Kṛṣṇa is laughing at him and he shows manifests his divine form and everyone is amazed and everyone is, you know, so much convulsion is there, everyone is crying and yelling and, you know, somebody can understand and Sañjaya is also and they are asking what's happening, what's happening, tell me, tell me, tell me this and everybody nobody can explain to him what's going on, so Dhṛtarāṣṭra at this moment Dhṛtarāṣṭra yelling directly to Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, for the first time, I must, if you give me the eyes to see, I want to see, this is the time when I give you the eyes, I want just for a second give me the vision because I was blind, I didn't see anything from my birth, give me the vision so that I could see what why they are, I don't receive this also, you know, I also want to be in this state, so at this particular moment he says why do you need the eyes?
You don't need the eyes, material eyes, to see me, you will see me. And at this moment he sees him. His eyes are still blind. His material eyes are still blind. But Krishna gives him vision. The spiritual vision.
And through spiritual vision he sees the spiritual you know universal form. And he also did it because the vision is there for them, you know, sometimes people, they get vision by their sleeping.
For them, you know, sometimes people they get vision by they're sleeping. When they're sleeping, the blind senses, they're not working, you know, their eyes are closed.
But they have experience, they see the Lord, the form of the Lord, they experience, they speak with the Lord, often after the material comes. No, pratyaksha means direct experience.
Pratyaksha here doesn't mean material experience, but it means direct experience. That's what it is. And pratyakṣa may also mean this, just direct experience. You have to have direct experience. Pratyakṣāvagamana.
And what Krishna wants to say is that you will get the direct experience of the Lord. You will feel the Lord's presence.
Not necessarily you will seek him, but you will feel this presence in the heart and this nurture in your life. I just gave an example of it.
Like, Christmas treasurement and lot of times between the three and six and so many. This is real, big time. Lots of a lot has tickets with you from this.
Yeah, he he's internally he is experiencing the mood of Rādhārāṇī. Internally he is experiencing the mood of Rādhārāṇī.
Preservation of devotional culture in difficult ages
If externally, is an attention of the prades inside. Yes. There will be vice never there. There will be vice members because, see, there will be less vice members as it will be.
Vice members will oversee there because this is the nature of the soul. The soul will will hold the and the culture will be there hidden somewhere in some place.
This place is is mentioned in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Sambhala, the village Sambhala and and that's the place for using ascent. So, the summer and Himalayas. We see that sometimes rice nodes are oppressed.
Like for example, living up Śaṅkarācārya, sometimes vaiṣṇavas are very good. And Madhvācārya's father, he was hiding himself from some remote village in some mountain area, you know.
So, he would be it sounds like they're hiding away from them, you know, they will do that.